WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:03.880 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC LOGO] 00:00:03.880 --> 00:00:14.570 align:middle line:90% 00:00:14.570 --> 00:00:16.440 align:middle line:84% Thank you all for being here today. 00:00:16.440 --> 00:00:17.660 align:middle line:90% My name is Rebecca Trawick. 00:00:17.660 --> 00:00:19.550 align:middle line:84% I'm the director and curator of the Wignall 00:00:19.550 --> 00:00:21.890 align:middle line:90% Museum at 性视界. 00:00:21.890 --> 00:00:24.230 align:middle line:84% Thanks so much for joining us today at-- 00:00:24.230 --> 00:00:26.750 align:middle line:84% today's artists talk featuring Susan Brand, presented 00:00:26.750 --> 00:00:29.300 align:middle line:84% as part of our current exhibition reunion. 00:00:29.300 --> 00:00:31.070 align:middle line:84% Reunion brings together works of art, 00:00:31.070 --> 00:00:32.960 align:middle line:84% and the written word from faculty and staff 00:00:32.960 --> 00:00:36.350 align:middle line:84% who teach and support instruction at 性视界. 00:00:36.350 --> 00:00:38.570 align:middle line:84% Reunion is on view at the Wignall Museum 00:00:38.570 --> 00:00:42.100 align:middle line:90% through March 11 2023. 00:00:42.100 --> 00:00:44.650 align:middle line:84% So today I'm pleased to introduce 00:00:44.650 --> 00:00:46.570 align:middle line:90% illustrator, Susan brand. 00:00:46.570 --> 00:00:50.020 align:middle line:84% Susan Brand grew up in the spare beauty of the desert Southwest 00:00:50.020 --> 00:00:52.450 align:middle line:84% where she fell in love with drawing and observing nature 00:00:52.450 --> 00:00:53.960 align:middle line:90% at an early age. 00:00:53.960 --> 00:00:56.110 align:middle line:84% She attended ArtCenter College of design, 00:00:56.110 --> 00:00:59.080 align:middle line:84% earning a BFA in Illustration and Advertising 00:00:59.080 --> 00:01:01.630 align:middle line:90% before moving to New York City. 00:01:01.630 --> 00:01:03.820 align:middle line:84% After an early career in animation and design, 00:01:03.820 --> 00:01:08.250 align:middle line:84% she discovered natural science illustration and found her joy. 00:01:08.250 --> 00:01:11.250 align:middle line:84% Brand is known for images of botanical and natural science 00:01:11.250 --> 00:01:14.770 align:middle line:84% subjects presented with brevity and acuity. 00:01:14.770 --> 00:01:18.940 align:middle line:84% She illustrated the cover of The Sound Of A Wild Snail Eating, 00:01:18.940 --> 00:01:23.650 align:middle line:84% by Elisabeth Tova Bailey, and recently provided interior-- 00:01:23.650 --> 00:01:26.770 align:middle line:84% excuse me, interior illustrations for Forager Field 00:01:26.770 --> 00:01:28.840 align:middle line:84% Notes For Surviving a Family Cult. 00:01:28.840 --> 00:01:32.030 align:middle line:84% a Memoir By Michelle Dowd, who is with us today. 00:01:32.030 --> 00:01:34.360 align:middle line:90% Hey, Michelle. 00:01:34.360 --> 00:01:37.948 align:middle line:84% And who is also a professor at 性视界. 00:01:37.948 --> 00:01:39.490 align:middle line:84% Michelle is a professor in journalism 00:01:39.490 --> 00:01:41.615 align:middle line:84% and English at 性视界 College, and she's currently 00:01:41.615 --> 00:01:43.900 align:middle line:84% on sabbatical and a book tour as Forager 00:01:43.900 --> 00:01:45.700 align:middle line:90% has launched this week-- 00:01:45.700 --> 00:01:48.950 align:middle line:84% actually, tomorrow evening at the Sam and Alfreda Maloof 00:01:48.950 --> 00:01:50.860 align:middle line:90% Foundation. 00:01:50.860 --> 00:01:54.040 align:middle line:84% Susan's studio is located in Maplewood, New Jersey. 00:01:54.040 --> 00:01:57.490 align:middle line:84% So please join me in giving Susan a warm virtual welcome. 00:01:57.490 --> 00:02:01.300 align:middle line:90% 00:02:01.300 --> 00:02:01.840 align:middle line:90% Hello. 00:02:01.840 --> 00:02:02.485 align:middle line:90% Thank you. 00:02:02.485 --> 00:02:04.990 align:middle line:90% 00:02:04.990 --> 00:02:07.000 align:middle line:84% It's nice to see this many people here. 00:02:07.000 --> 00:02:09.430 align:middle line:90% Hello, Michel. 00:02:09.430 --> 00:02:11.800 align:middle line:84% I'm going to share my screen and get started. 00:02:11.800 --> 00:02:15.490 align:middle line:90% 00:02:15.490 --> 00:02:18.430 align:middle line:90% Start at the beginning. 00:02:18.430 --> 00:02:22.060 align:middle line:90% I was born in El Paso, Texas. 00:02:22.060 --> 00:02:25.480 align:middle line:84% It's at the western tippy-tip of Texas, 00:02:25.480 --> 00:02:29.680 align:middle line:84% and sandwiched between New Mexico and Mexico. 00:02:29.680 --> 00:02:32.770 align:middle line:84% The city itself is wrapped around this mountain, 00:02:32.770 --> 00:02:36.130 align:middle line:84% and you either lived on the east side or the west side. 00:02:36.130 --> 00:02:38.440 align:middle line:90% We lived on the west side. 00:02:38.440 --> 00:02:40.900 align:middle line:90% This beautiful desert. 00:02:40.900 --> 00:02:45.340 align:middle line:84% The colors changed constantly for the very subtle beauty, 00:02:45.340 --> 00:02:48.940 align:middle line:84% and the sunsets were spectacular. 00:02:48.940 --> 00:02:50.330 align:middle line:90% I grew up in this house. 00:02:50.330 --> 00:02:55.210 align:middle line:84% My father was a homebuilder, and he built our house. 00:02:55.210 --> 00:02:58.060 align:middle line:90% You can see the mountain behind. 00:02:58.060 --> 00:03:02.260 align:middle line:84% When we were kids, we were basically told to go play. 00:03:02.260 --> 00:03:03.670 align:middle line:90% Parents didn't want to see us. 00:03:03.670 --> 00:03:06.370 align:middle line:84% They didn't-- they wouldn't engage with us. 00:03:06.370 --> 00:03:07.990 align:middle line:90% They sent us out to play. 00:03:07.990 --> 00:03:13.550 align:middle line:84% So we often just ran around until the streetlights came on. 00:03:13.550 --> 00:03:18.430 align:middle line:84% But one of the obvious things to do is go explore the desert. 00:03:18.430 --> 00:03:22.030 align:middle line:84% And we got very familiar with rocks, 00:03:22.030 --> 00:03:25.520 align:middle line:90% and seed pods, and thornes. 00:03:25.520 --> 00:03:28.280 align:middle line:84% I think we've spent most of our childhood pushing 00:03:28.280 --> 00:03:30.740 align:middle line:90% each other into cactuses. 00:03:30.740 --> 00:03:34.130 align:middle line:84% Looking for snacks, looking for fossils. 00:03:34.130 --> 00:03:37.100 align:middle line:84% And if we really, really quiet in the desert, 00:03:37.100 --> 00:03:41.670 align:middle line:84% you could easily see all of this wildlife, 00:03:41.670 --> 00:03:44.720 align:middle line:84% including that rattlesnake, which 00:03:44.720 --> 00:03:47.480 align:middle line:84% I guess we were smart enough to stay away from, 00:03:47.480 --> 00:03:48.380 align:middle line:90% most of the time. 00:03:48.380 --> 00:03:51.410 align:middle line:90% 00:03:51.410 --> 00:03:54.880 align:middle line:84% Another big influence growing up was the colors 00:03:54.880 --> 00:03:58.400 align:middle line:90% of living on the border. 00:03:58.400 --> 00:04:02.380 align:middle line:84% Everything was really colorful and festive, 00:04:02.380 --> 00:04:05.680 align:middle line:84% and the border was very porous at the time. 00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:08.950 align:middle line:84% A lot of people had family on both sides of the border. 00:04:08.950 --> 00:04:12.740 align:middle line:84% Some people lived on one side, and worked on the other. 00:04:12.740 --> 00:04:14.900 align:middle line:84% It was a lot more porous than it is now 00:04:14.900 --> 00:04:18.570 align:middle line:90% because of national security. 00:04:18.570 --> 00:04:22.690 align:middle line:90% And the food was spectacular. 00:04:22.690 --> 00:04:25.320 align:middle line:84% One of the places that I love to visit, 00:04:25.320 --> 00:04:27.900 align:middle line:84% that was about a half mile walk from my house, 00:04:27.900 --> 00:04:30.510 align:middle line:84% was the University of Texas in El Paso. 00:04:30.510 --> 00:04:33.120 align:middle line:84% So you can see it's Bhutan architecture, 00:04:33.120 --> 00:04:34.605 align:middle line:90% Himalayan on the border. 00:04:34.605 --> 00:04:37.110 align:middle line:90% 00:04:37.110 --> 00:04:41.190 align:middle line:84% The natural science museum was filled with curiosities. 00:04:41.190 --> 00:04:43.770 align:middle line:84% It's a little more standardized now. 00:04:43.770 --> 00:04:46.710 align:middle line:84% At the time it was kind of like a Victorian cabinet 00:04:46.710 --> 00:04:51.520 align:middle line:84% of curiosities, and the curators were very patient. 00:04:51.520 --> 00:04:55.920 align:middle line:84% We asked a lot of questions, and they were happy to fill us in. 00:04:55.920 --> 00:04:59.070 align:middle line:84% The other place I like to visit was the museum. 00:04:59.070 --> 00:05:03.380 align:middle line:84% They started taking us in school trips. 00:05:03.380 --> 00:05:06.410 align:middle line:84% When we were kids, there was a world class collection. 00:05:06.410 --> 00:05:08.930 align:middle line:84% The owner of a local department store 00:05:08.930 --> 00:05:14.330 align:middle line:84% had acquired a Botticelli, and Byzantine paintings on wood, 00:05:14.330 --> 00:05:18.320 align:middle line:84% as well as Spanish and Mexican folk art 00:05:18.320 --> 00:05:23.240 align:middle line:90% and modern masterpieces. 00:05:23.240 --> 00:05:25.350 align:middle line:90% I loved school. 00:05:25.350 --> 00:05:27.890 align:middle line:90% At school was my place. 00:05:27.890 --> 00:05:32.420 align:middle line:84% School was my safe place, and I got really high grades. 00:05:32.420 --> 00:05:37.580 align:middle line:84% Really good grades and I always, always, always was drawing. 00:05:37.580 --> 00:05:39.530 align:middle line:90% I Drew everything. 00:05:39.530 --> 00:05:44.060 align:middle line:84% I always had a paper with me and pencils. 00:05:44.060 --> 00:05:48.980 align:middle line:84% I assumed that I would continue to see all the people I'd 00:05:48.980 --> 00:05:51.560 align:middle line:84% always known and grown up with all the way 00:05:51.560 --> 00:05:53.000 align:middle line:90% through high school. 00:05:53.000 --> 00:05:57.560 align:middle line:84% And at the high school, I was in the drama 00:05:57.560 --> 00:06:04.010 align:middle line:84% club, and cheer person, and painting murals 00:06:04.010 --> 00:06:06.650 align:middle line:90% in the cafeteria. 00:06:06.650 --> 00:06:08.390 align:middle line:90% Very involved. 00:06:08.390 --> 00:06:12.170 align:middle line:84% In the middle of my sophomore year, my mother 00:06:12.170 --> 00:06:18.200 align:middle line:84% surprised us with a move to Chula Vista, California. 00:06:18.200 --> 00:06:21.990 align:middle line:84% So out of the blue, I was living somewhere 00:06:21.990 --> 00:06:23.880 align:middle line:90% where I didn't know a soul. 00:06:23.880 --> 00:06:26.010 align:middle line:84% Everyone already had their friends. 00:06:26.010 --> 00:06:32.340 align:middle line:84% I wasn't sure what was in store for me, and I had art, though. 00:06:32.340 --> 00:06:35.700 align:middle line:84% I continued to make art, unfortunately, 00:06:35.700 --> 00:06:40.050 align:middle line:84% the high school that I went to had one art class, 00:06:40.050 --> 00:06:41.910 align:middle line:90% and it was OK. 00:06:41.910 --> 00:06:44.910 align:middle line:84% But, there was a graphic arts class 00:06:44.910 --> 00:06:47.220 align:middle line:90% and a vocational curriculum. 00:06:47.220 --> 00:06:50.250 align:middle line:90% So this is way before computers. 00:06:50.250 --> 00:06:53.550 align:middle line:84% I'll give you a little context for that soon. 00:06:53.550 --> 00:06:57.120 align:middle line:84% Everything had to be done with a t-square, a triangle, 00:06:57.120 --> 00:06:58.680 align:middle line:90% and an x-acto knife. 00:06:58.680 --> 00:07:02.490 align:middle line:84% And that's me using x-acto knife at age 16. 00:07:02.490 --> 00:07:05.100 align:middle line:84% And we learned how to print on a press 00:07:05.100 --> 00:07:07.620 align:middle line:84% similar to the one in the picture 00:07:07.620 --> 00:07:11.340 align:middle line:84% when we did the school newspapers, and memo pads, 00:07:11.340 --> 00:07:13.770 align:middle line:84% and silkscreened bumper stickers. 00:07:13.770 --> 00:07:15.000 align:middle line:90% There was a dark room. 00:07:15.000 --> 00:07:18.300 align:middle line:84% There was everything you needed to have a little print shop. 00:07:18.300 --> 00:07:20.790 align:middle line:84% And that turned out to be a really good place 00:07:20.790 --> 00:07:24.120 align:middle line:90% for me to spend time. 00:07:24.120 --> 00:07:27.960 align:middle line:84% We also had a photo typositor machine. 00:07:27.960 --> 00:07:30.860 align:middle line:84% And this was how you could get type headlines. 00:07:30.860 --> 00:07:33.830 align:middle line:84% You had to type it in and this machine 00:07:33.830 --> 00:07:39.410 align:middle line:84% developed the photography on reels of negatives. 00:07:39.410 --> 00:07:42.350 align:middle line:84% There was letters, and you could make headlines. 00:07:42.350 --> 00:07:46.230 align:middle line:90% That was the big news there. 00:07:46.230 --> 00:07:49.710 align:middle line:84% This is what a personal computer looked like at that point 00:07:49.710 --> 00:07:54.030 align:middle line:84% in time, just to give you some context. 00:07:54.030 --> 00:07:58.880 align:middle line:84% I also worked in a bookstore and discovered underground comics. 00:07:58.880 --> 00:08:01.790 align:middle line:84% I loved, loved, loved underground comics. 00:08:01.790 --> 00:08:03.410 align:middle line:90% I love comics of any kind. 00:08:03.410 --> 00:08:08.280 align:middle line:84% Also working the bookstore was really amazing 00:08:08.280 --> 00:08:10.830 align:middle line:84% because there was every single book and magazine 00:08:10.830 --> 00:08:14.490 align:middle line:84% available in San Diego County at this bookstore, 00:08:14.490 --> 00:08:17.880 align:middle line:84% and I learned a lot about how books 00:08:17.880 --> 00:08:22.130 align:middle line:84% were stocked, how they were merchandised, and magazines 00:08:22.130 --> 00:08:22.630 align:middle line:90% as well. 00:08:22.630 --> 00:08:25.350 align:middle line:84% And I could look through any magazines I wanted. 00:08:25.350 --> 00:08:28.770 align:middle line:90% 00:08:28.770 --> 00:08:31.020 align:middle line:84% Since it was the end of high school, 00:08:31.020 --> 00:08:34.890 align:middle line:84% the mode was for everyone to decide 00:08:34.890 --> 00:08:36.990 align:middle line:84% what their career was going to be, 00:08:36.990 --> 00:08:39.809 align:middle line:84% and I just always assumed I'd be an artist. 00:08:39.809 --> 00:08:42.059 align:middle line:84% I was getting pressured by the guidance counselor 00:08:42.059 --> 00:08:46.960 align:middle line:90% to look into science and math. 00:08:46.960 --> 00:08:49.030 align:middle line:84% But I really wanted to be an artist. 00:08:49.030 --> 00:08:51.810 align:middle line:84% And one of the guidance counselors told me, 00:08:51.810 --> 00:08:54.090 align:middle line:84% you could be a commercial artist. 00:08:54.090 --> 00:08:56.760 align:middle line:84% And I thought that sounded savvy. 00:08:56.760 --> 00:08:59.850 align:middle line:84% You could make-- you could make money making art, 00:08:59.850 --> 00:09:02.640 align:middle line:84% because I just couldn't imagine acquiring enough 00:09:02.640 --> 00:09:05.550 align:middle line:84% patrons to make a living for my paintings, 00:09:05.550 --> 00:09:08.730 align:middle line:84% but I love the idea of commercial art. 00:09:08.730 --> 00:09:11.130 align:middle line:84% In the high school library, there 00:09:11.130 --> 00:09:14.160 align:middle line:84% was a magazine called Graphis Magazine, 00:09:14.160 --> 00:09:15.900 align:middle line:84% and I used to go on my lunch hour 00:09:15.900 --> 00:09:18.270 align:middle line:84% and just pour through these magazines 00:09:18.270 --> 00:09:22.320 align:middle line:84% with these amazing illustrations, and important 00:09:22.320 --> 00:09:23.790 align:middle line:90% looking design. 00:09:23.790 --> 00:09:28.320 align:middle line:84% And over and over, I could see that the designers being 00:09:28.320 --> 00:09:31.530 align:middle line:90% profiled had gone to ArtCenter. 00:09:31.530 --> 00:09:33.810 align:middle line:84% And I mentioned that to the librarian, 00:09:33.810 --> 00:09:37.350 align:middle line:84% and a week later, she said, I've got something for you. 00:09:37.350 --> 00:09:43.590 align:middle line:84% And this yellow square was the catalog for ArtCenter College, 00:09:43.590 --> 00:09:47.050 align:middle line:84% and I thought that was slick already. 00:09:47.050 --> 00:09:50.440 align:middle line:84% ArtCenter College looked really business-like and really 00:09:50.440 --> 00:09:52.810 align:middle line:84% important, and it looked like some place 00:09:52.810 --> 00:09:56.230 align:middle line:84% that I could learn how to make all those slick arty 00:09:56.230 --> 00:09:59.550 align:middle line:90% things in the Graphis Magazine. 00:09:59.550 --> 00:10:04.230 align:middle line:84% And people were obviously making things and treating it 00:10:04.230 --> 00:10:07.560 align:middle line:84% very seriously, and I really wanted to go there, 00:10:07.560 --> 00:10:10.920 align:middle line:84% and then I saw the painting studio 00:10:10.920 --> 00:10:13.230 align:middle line:84% and I figured that would be a dream. 00:10:13.230 --> 00:10:15.180 align:middle line:84% And actually the man in the center 00:10:15.180 --> 00:10:18.960 align:middle line:84% in the back, talking like he knows what he's doing, 00:10:18.960 --> 00:10:22.500 align:middle line:84% was one of my painting professors. 00:10:22.500 --> 00:10:25.770 align:middle line:84% So to go to the ArtCenter, you would need a portfolio. 00:10:25.770 --> 00:10:29.040 align:middle line:84% My graphic arts teacher was also the photography teacher 00:10:29.040 --> 00:10:35.060 align:middle line:84% and he started photographing all of the art I'd accumulated up 00:10:35.060 --> 00:10:36.710 align:middle line:90% in that point. 00:10:36.710 --> 00:10:40.400 align:middle line:84% This is my high school art, including the memo pads 00:10:40.400 --> 00:10:42.800 align:middle line:90% we made in the print shop. 00:10:42.800 --> 00:10:46.880 align:middle line:84% And you could tell it was the 70s. 00:10:46.880 --> 00:10:51.350 align:middle line:84% And the way that you would present a portfolio in 1979 00:10:51.350 --> 00:10:53.610 align:middle line:90% was on slides. 00:10:53.610 --> 00:10:56.510 align:middle line:90% So back to El Paso. 00:10:56.510 --> 00:11:00.140 align:middle line:84% I started college at the University of Texas. 00:11:00.140 --> 00:11:03.230 align:middle line:84% The Himalayan looking University, 00:11:03.230 --> 00:11:08.660 align:middle line:84% and I took printmaking and got all of my general education out 00:11:08.660 --> 00:11:11.900 align:middle line:84% of the way, so I wouldn't have to be doing that at ArtCenter. 00:11:11.900 --> 00:11:14.780 align:middle line:84% And I applied to ArtCenter, figuring-- 00:11:14.780 --> 00:11:19.220 align:middle line:84% I'd been told it would take a few times to apply and get in. 00:11:19.220 --> 00:11:21.650 align:middle line:90% And I also met my people. 00:11:21.650 --> 00:11:24.260 align:middle line:84% I realized other artists were lots of fun. 00:11:24.260 --> 00:11:26.570 align:middle line:84% Other artists understood all the weird things 00:11:26.570 --> 00:11:29.180 align:middle line:84% that I thought and did, and other artists 00:11:29.180 --> 00:11:33.730 align:middle line:84% were willing to dress up like wizards at the drop of a hat. 00:11:33.730 --> 00:11:36.210 align:middle line:84% And I did get into Art Center on the first try. 00:11:36.210 --> 00:11:38.090 align:middle line:90% I was not expecting that. 00:11:38.090 --> 00:11:40.180 align:middle line:90% And so I moved to Pasadena. 00:11:40.180 --> 00:11:42.080 align:middle line:90% I didn't know a single person. 00:11:42.080 --> 00:11:46.140 align:middle line:84% All I knew was I was accepted to ArtCenter. 00:11:46.140 --> 00:11:50.050 align:middle line:84% and it really did look like this, which blew me away. 00:11:50.050 --> 00:11:52.890 align:middle line:84% And everyone did seem to always have something to do 00:11:52.890 --> 00:11:56.010 align:middle line:84% and I did end up taking the painting classes, 00:11:56.010 --> 00:11:59.480 align:middle line:84% and I ended up making weird stuff in the shop. 00:11:59.480 --> 00:12:02.250 align:middle line:90% And I met more of my people. 00:12:02.250 --> 00:12:04.170 align:middle line:90% And that was fantastic. 00:12:04.170 --> 00:12:06.530 align:middle line:84% I'm still in touch with so many people 00:12:06.530 --> 00:12:09.390 align:middle line:90% that I went to ArtCenter with. 00:12:09.390 --> 00:12:11.070 align:middle line:90% And now came the hard part. 00:12:11.070 --> 00:12:12.030 align:middle line:90% Looking for work. 00:12:12.030 --> 00:12:14.520 align:middle line:90% Now you're out of school. 00:12:14.520 --> 00:12:16.350 align:middle line:90% I was still in LA. 00:12:16.350 --> 00:12:18.070 align:middle line:90% And what did you do? 00:12:18.070 --> 00:12:19.860 align:middle line:84% You put a portfolio together, so I 00:12:19.860 --> 00:12:21.930 align:middle line:84% took my life drawings and my packaging, 00:12:21.930 --> 00:12:25.410 align:middle line:84% and the art I created, and put in a big portfolio. 00:12:25.410 --> 00:12:28.500 align:middle line:84% And you would call people, and you'd 00:12:28.500 --> 00:12:30.690 align:middle line:84% call our directors and designers, 00:12:30.690 --> 00:12:36.360 align:middle line:84% and record cover designers, and you'd go to their studios. 00:12:36.360 --> 00:12:39.205 align:middle line:84% You'd bring your big portfolio, and you'd put it down 00:12:39.205 --> 00:12:40.830 align:middle line:84% and then maybe they'd have a light box, 00:12:40.830 --> 00:12:42.600 align:middle line:90% and they'd look at your slides. 00:12:42.600 --> 00:12:46.050 align:middle line:84% And hopefully, all the other designers would gather around 00:12:46.050 --> 00:12:49.200 align:middle line:84% and you'd give everyone business cards or post cards. 00:12:49.200 --> 00:12:51.930 align:middle line:84% And that way, they'd remember who 00:12:51.930 --> 00:12:55.970 align:middle line:84% you were in case they had something that you could do. 00:12:55.970 --> 00:12:58.300 align:middle line:84% So I got a couple of design jobs. 00:12:58.300 --> 00:13:01.810 align:middle line:84% I met every single record designer at Warner Brothers. 00:13:01.810 --> 00:13:04.570 align:middle line:84% And it was a lot of driving around 00:13:04.570 --> 00:13:07.810 align:middle line:84% and a lot of discouragement and everyone 00:13:07.810 --> 00:13:09.970 align:middle line:90% I knew was moving to New York. 00:13:09.970 --> 00:13:13.570 align:middle line:84% And I finally got a job, painting matte cells 00:13:13.570 --> 00:13:19.420 align:middle line:84% for a special effect, for a Burger King commercial. 00:13:19.420 --> 00:13:22.750 align:middle line:84% Those are flying hamburgers and Pepsis. 00:13:22.750 --> 00:13:26.860 align:middle line:84% And I was basically in a spare studio 00:13:26.860 --> 00:13:31.330 align:middle line:84% painting black paint onto cells to mask that stuff off, 00:13:31.330 --> 00:13:33.880 align:middle line:84% and I got home and there was a message on my answering 00:13:33.880 --> 00:13:36.460 align:middle line:84% machine, and a friend of mine who was-- 00:13:36.460 --> 00:13:40.930 align:middle line:84% now an art director at J. Walter Thompson in New York 00:13:40.930 --> 00:13:43.810 align:middle line:84% was in town, and wanted to see if I wanted to hang out. 00:13:43.810 --> 00:13:46.810 align:middle line:84% And she was in town for a shoot, and she 00:13:46.810 --> 00:13:49.390 align:middle line:90% was shooting this commercial. 00:13:49.390 --> 00:13:53.470 align:middle line:84% So I went from doing the mat sells on the flying hamburgers, 00:13:53.470 --> 00:13:56.830 align:middle line:84% and I went and met her on set, and we had a great time, 00:13:56.830 --> 00:13:59.170 align:middle line:84% and she told me how great New York was 00:13:59.170 --> 00:14:01.630 align:middle line:90% and we went back to her hotel. 00:14:01.630 --> 00:14:04.210 align:middle line:84% And right at the last minute, I parked my car 00:14:04.210 --> 00:14:06.100 align:middle line:90% and I took my portfolio with me. 00:14:06.100 --> 00:14:07.870 align:middle line:90% I still don't know why. 00:14:07.870 --> 00:14:11.440 align:middle line:84% This is in West Hollywood and at the time a lot of cars 00:14:11.440 --> 00:14:14.860 align:middle line:84% were getting towed because they had really bad signage 00:14:14.860 --> 00:14:18.220 align:middle line:84% for parking, and you could come out and your car would be gone. 00:14:18.220 --> 00:14:20.260 align:middle line:84% And you'd have to go get it out of impound 00:14:20.260 --> 00:14:21.700 align:middle line:90% because of parking laws. 00:14:21.700 --> 00:14:25.850 align:middle line:84% Well my car was gone, But it was stolen. 00:14:25.850 --> 00:14:29.620 align:middle line:84% And I was there with my portfolio and no car 00:14:29.620 --> 00:14:31.900 align:middle line:90% in Los Angeles. 00:14:31.900 --> 00:14:33.790 align:middle line:90% A week later, they found my car. 00:14:33.790 --> 00:14:37.310 align:middle line:84% It was totaled, and I got all my insurance money. 00:14:37.310 --> 00:14:40.580 align:middle line:84% And at that point, I had a decision to make. 00:14:40.580 --> 00:14:43.750 align:middle line:84% Did I want to start to buy another car, 00:14:43.750 --> 00:14:47.080 align:middle line:84% or did I want to go somewhere where I didn't need 00:14:47.080 --> 00:14:50.320 align:middle line:90% a car with a little nest egg. 00:14:50.320 --> 00:14:54.930 align:middle line:84% This is what personal computers look like in 1984. 00:14:54.930 --> 00:14:57.270 align:middle line:90% And I moved to New York. 00:14:57.270 --> 00:15:00.520 align:middle line:90% So New York City-- 00:15:00.520 --> 00:15:02.740 align:middle line:84% as I was taking my portfolio around, 00:15:02.740 --> 00:15:06.470 align:middle line:84% I was making lots of other work, I 00:15:06.470 --> 00:15:10.310 align:middle line:84% started making these shrines, these three dimensional boxes. 00:15:10.310 --> 00:15:15.210 align:middle line:84% And I started selling them in little galleries and to people. 00:15:15.210 --> 00:15:17.570 align:middle line:84% And again, I was taking my portfolio around 00:15:17.570 --> 00:15:19.100 align:middle line:90% with the new work. 00:15:19.100 --> 00:15:22.040 align:middle line:90% I went to see lots of designers. 00:15:22.040 --> 00:15:23.760 align:middle line:90% I went to record companies. 00:15:23.760 --> 00:15:27.350 align:middle line:84% I got a little regular gig doing illustrations 00:15:27.350 --> 00:15:30.020 align:middle line:90% for Elektra Records. 00:15:30.020 --> 00:15:34.400 align:middle line:84% And the director in Los Angeles that I 00:15:34.400 --> 00:15:37.670 align:middle line:84% had done the effects for called me up and he said, listen, go 00:15:37.670 --> 00:15:40.760 align:middle line:84% see Ariel Blackman, he's looking at portfolios. 00:15:40.760 --> 00:15:42.830 align:middle line:84% And everyone wanted to know who was looking 00:15:42.830 --> 00:15:46.100 align:middle line:84% at portfolios because you could call up and show 00:15:46.100 --> 00:15:47.270 align:middle line:90% your portfolio. 00:15:47.270 --> 00:15:50.180 align:middle line:84% And it was if they were open or we're 00:15:50.180 --> 00:15:53.720 align:middle line:84% slow and looking at young illustrators work. 00:15:53.720 --> 00:15:56.540 align:middle line:84% So I got prepared and I was really nervous 00:15:56.540 --> 00:16:00.960 align:middle line:84% because I'd seen Ariel Blackman's illustrations 00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:02.550 align:middle line:90% on the New Yorker. 00:16:02.550 --> 00:16:05.640 align:middle line:84% And at the time, there was a commercial running 00:16:05.640 --> 00:16:11.370 align:middle line:84% that had the cavemen and it was in his style. 00:16:11.370 --> 00:16:13.380 align:middle line:90% He was a really nice guy. 00:16:13.380 --> 00:16:18.270 align:middle line:84% It was in this building on 47th Street, 00:16:18.270 --> 00:16:22.230 align:middle line:84% and the Jewelers exchange, the top floor of that building 00:16:22.230 --> 00:16:26.940 align:middle line:84% and inside it was like a medieval castle. 00:16:26.940 --> 00:16:30.060 align:middle line:84% The people who had built that studio out 00:16:30.060 --> 00:16:32.250 align:middle line:84% at the turn of the century had designed 00:16:32.250 --> 00:16:34.860 align:middle line:90% St Bartholomew's church. 00:16:34.860 --> 00:16:37.560 align:middle line:90% This fireplace was huge. 00:16:37.560 --> 00:16:40.170 align:middle line:84% The whole room was paneled with wood. 00:16:40.170 --> 00:16:41.970 align:middle line:90% The ceiling was sculpted. 00:16:41.970 --> 00:16:45.030 align:middle line:90% There was leaded glass windows. 00:16:45.030 --> 00:16:48.480 align:middle line:84% It was an incredible room and I was completely intimidated, 00:16:48.480 --> 00:16:49.950 align:middle line:90% and almost not listening. 00:16:49.950 --> 00:16:52.230 align:middle line:90% And he liked my portfolio. 00:16:52.230 --> 00:16:55.810 align:middle line:84% He was-- held things upside down and looked at them. 00:16:55.810 --> 00:16:59.250 align:middle line:84% And at one point he said, can you set type? 00:16:59.250 --> 00:17:01.800 align:middle line:84% And I said, Yes, I know how to set type. 00:17:01.800 --> 00:17:02.550 align:middle line:90% And he said, OK. 00:17:02.550 --> 00:17:04.319 align:middle line:90% Can start tomorrow? 00:17:04.319 --> 00:17:08.369 align:middle line:84% And I thought he was offering me a little gig, 00:17:08.369 --> 00:17:10.349 align:middle line:90% setting some type for him. 00:17:10.349 --> 00:17:13.020 align:middle line:84% And then he said, but you'll have to learn animation. 00:17:13.020 --> 00:17:15.900 align:middle line:90% And I didn't understand at all. 00:17:15.900 --> 00:17:20.700 align:middle line:84% And then he took me downstairs, one floor down. 00:17:20.700 --> 00:17:24.720 align:middle line:84% And there was an entire animation studio, with people 00:17:24.720 --> 00:17:26.940 align:middle line:90% working, and work tables. 00:17:26.940 --> 00:17:29.040 align:middle line:84% And they were making commercials, 00:17:29.040 --> 00:17:31.890 align:middle line:84% and they were finishing a feature length film 00:17:31.890 --> 00:17:35.940 align:middle line:84% that he-- in his style, called the soldier's tale. 00:17:35.940 --> 00:17:39.540 align:middle line:84% And it was airing om-- about to air on PBS. 00:17:39.540 --> 00:17:41.520 align:middle line:84% And what he needed me to type for 00:17:41.520 --> 00:17:47.670 align:middle line:84% was a circle sticker that was going to go on the VHS package. 00:17:47.670 --> 00:17:52.710 align:middle line:84% And I started working in the animation studio the next day. 00:17:52.710 --> 00:17:55.960 align:middle line:84% I joined a Union and I met other people. 00:17:55.960 --> 00:18:00.870 align:middle line:90% That's me at my animation desk. 00:18:00.870 --> 00:18:03.810 align:middle line:90% It was an amazing place to work. 00:18:03.810 --> 00:18:06.260 align:middle line:84% First of all, he was animating the style 00:18:06.260 --> 00:18:08.510 align:middle line:90% of every illustrator I admired. 00:18:08.510 --> 00:18:13.100 align:middle line:84% We were animating Seymour Chwast, and Steven Guarnaccia, 00:18:13.100 --> 00:18:15.410 align:middle line:90% Brad Holland. 00:18:15.410 --> 00:18:16.400 align:middle line:90% It was insane. 00:18:16.400 --> 00:18:19.850 align:middle line:84% And every Friday he would host a lunch 00:18:19.850 --> 00:18:23.090 align:middle line:84% and invite whatever illustrator he 00:18:23.090 --> 00:18:26.570 align:middle line:84% was hanging out with at the time to talk to all of us. 00:18:26.570 --> 00:18:28.220 align:middle line:84% And it was a great way for all of us 00:18:28.220 --> 00:18:31.190 align:middle line:90% to connect with each other. 00:18:31.190 --> 00:18:32.510 align:middle line:90% One time he had-- 00:18:32.510 --> 00:18:35.510 align:middle line:84% Art Spiegelman came, Mous had just come out, 00:18:35.510 --> 00:18:39.290 align:middle line:84% and we all got signed copies of Mous. 00:18:39.290 --> 00:18:41.910 align:middle line:84% Just on and on, it was a real privilege. 00:18:41.910 --> 00:18:43.565 align:middle line:84% So I worked there for three years. 00:18:43.565 --> 00:18:46.890 align:middle line:90% 00:18:46.890 --> 00:18:49.590 align:middle line:84% Within the first two weeks of working there, 00:18:49.590 --> 00:18:56.640 align:middle line:84% I got a strange assignment that made the sales rep panic. 00:18:56.640 --> 00:19:00.020 align:middle line:84% Blackman had started the storyboard 00:19:00.020 --> 00:19:03.230 align:middle line:84% and got into the sixth frame, and then left town. 00:19:03.230 --> 00:19:07.910 align:middle line:84% And basically asked me to finish the concept. 00:19:07.910 --> 00:19:10.640 align:middle line:84% Make the storyboard, present it to the client 00:19:10.640 --> 00:19:12.830 align:middle line:90% without him approving it. 00:19:12.830 --> 00:19:17.540 align:middle line:90% And I panicked and did it. 00:19:17.540 --> 00:19:20.840 align:middle line:84% I came up with the idea of using shadow puppets. 00:19:20.840 --> 00:19:26.270 align:middle line:84% And it actually got produced and the representative was-- 00:19:26.270 --> 00:19:27.470 align:middle line:90% hopefully this will play. 00:19:27.470 --> 00:19:31.210 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:19:31.210 --> 00:20:03.450 align:middle line:90% 00:20:03.450 --> 00:20:08.010 align:middle line:90% So I think he made it out alive. 00:20:08.010 --> 00:20:11.610 align:middle line:84% During my time there, we worked on hundreds 00:20:11.610 --> 00:20:14.430 align:middle line:84% of commercials over the course of the three years 00:20:14.430 --> 00:20:18.960 align:middle line:84% that I worked there, and had a couple of chances to use 00:20:18.960 --> 00:20:22.740 align:middle line:90% my collage style on spots too. 00:20:22.740 --> 00:20:24.690 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:20:24.690 --> 00:20:27.540 align:middle line:84% This special presentation of The Nutcracker 00:20:27.540 --> 00:20:30.510 align:middle line:84% is made possible by a grant from IBM. 00:20:30.510 --> 00:20:32.610 align:middle line:84% We offer this celebration of the holiday 00:20:32.610 --> 00:20:36.705 align:middle line:84% season with the very best wishes of IBM people around the world. 00:20:36.705 --> 00:20:43.060 align:middle line:90% 00:20:43.060 --> 00:20:46.500 align:middle line:84% This special presentation of the Vienna day concert 00:20:46.500 --> 00:20:49.290 align:middle line:84% is made possible by a grant from IBM. 00:20:49.290 --> 00:20:51.750 align:middle line:84% We offer this celebration of the new year 00:20:51.750 --> 00:20:54.300 align:middle line:84% with the very best wishes of IBM people 00:20:54.300 --> 00:20:57.870 align:middle line:90% here and around the world. 00:20:57.870 --> 00:21:00.120 align:middle line:84% Trying to keep up with business communications 00:21:00.120 --> 00:21:04.630 align:middle line:84% is enough to make anyone feel lost. 00:21:04.630 --> 00:21:07.380 align:middle line:84% Fortunately, there are the 9x advisors. 00:21:07.380 --> 00:21:10.050 align:middle line:84% Experts who've conquered the toughest communications 00:21:10.050 --> 00:21:11.020 align:middle line:90% territory. 00:21:11.020 --> 00:21:14.460 align:middle line:84% They'll show you what you do need and what you don't. 00:21:14.460 --> 00:21:19.055 align:middle line:84% In phones, integrated voice and data systems, networking too. 00:21:19.055 --> 00:21:21.850 align:middle line:84% So you and your system will feel right at home. 00:21:21.850 --> 00:21:24.070 align:middle line:90% 9x business information systems. 00:21:24.070 --> 00:21:26.590 align:middle line:84% Communications, without complications. 00:21:26.590 --> 00:21:32.550 align:middle line:90% 00:21:32.550 --> 00:21:44.520 align:middle line:84% I'm sorry So after three years and hundreds of commercials, 00:21:44.520 --> 00:21:49.440 align:middle line:84% it really was a super amazing experience 00:21:49.440 --> 00:21:52.170 align:middle line:84% but I wanted to get back to painting and doing 00:21:52.170 --> 00:21:54.780 align:middle line:90% illustrations. 00:21:54.780 --> 00:22:01.110 align:middle line:84% Also Blackman was super, super picky perfectionist. 00:22:01.110 --> 00:22:02.850 align:middle line:84% One of the last things he had me do 00:22:02.850 --> 00:22:06.420 align:middle line:84% is he wanted an exit sign for the studio, 00:22:06.420 --> 00:22:09.930 align:middle line:84% and you could see you finally use this. 00:22:09.930 --> 00:22:13.080 align:middle line:84% And I knew the one way that I could think of something. 00:22:13.080 --> 00:22:16.470 align:middle line:84% The one thing I could design would be his own handwriting, 00:22:16.470 --> 00:22:18.150 align:middle line:84% because then he couldn't critique 00:22:18.150 --> 00:22:20.530 align:middle line:90% the font used or whatever. 00:22:20.530 --> 00:22:23.580 align:middle line:84% So I had him write the word exit, 00:22:23.580 --> 00:22:26.970 align:middle line:84% and then blew it up on the Xerox machine. 00:22:26.970 --> 00:22:32.130 align:middle line:84% And I had left it on my desk, and gone 00:22:32.130 --> 00:22:35.880 align:middle line:84% to get the supplies to cut the mask to make the sign, 00:22:35.880 --> 00:22:38.790 align:middle line:84% and I came to my desk and I saw this little note 00:22:38.790 --> 00:22:43.770 align:middle line:84% that says, Susan, I retouched the x on this bottom right, 00:22:43.770 --> 00:22:44.670 align:middle line:90% Bob. 00:22:44.670 --> 00:22:47.550 align:middle line:84% And I couldn't figure out what he changed. 00:22:47.550 --> 00:22:49.510 align:middle line:90% It looked exactly the same. 00:22:49.510 --> 00:22:55.890 align:middle line:84% And then I realized he added this little bump on the x. 00:22:55.890 --> 00:22:59.760 align:middle line:84% So that pretty much sums up what it was like to work for him. 00:22:59.760 --> 00:23:02.220 align:middle line:84% It was a little stressful, but like I said, 00:23:02.220 --> 00:23:06.270 align:middle line:84% it was an incredible, incredible, experience. 00:23:06.270 --> 00:23:08.340 align:middle line:90% And I went freelance. 00:23:08.340 --> 00:23:11.040 align:middle line:90% I was self-employed. 00:23:11.040 --> 00:23:15.120 align:middle line:84% I started getting more illustration work. 00:23:15.120 --> 00:23:17.580 align:middle line:84% I still was doing my newsletter for Elektra. 00:23:17.580 --> 00:23:19.890 align:middle line:90% I was doing some package design. 00:23:19.890 --> 00:23:22.470 align:middle line:84% And I was also still doing animation, 00:23:22.470 --> 00:23:30.370 align:middle line:84% and after a few years, I'd gotten a little real together. 00:23:30.370 --> 00:23:31.300 align:middle line:90% So I'll play that. 00:23:31.300 --> 00:23:33.100 align:middle line:90% Hopefully this won't be as loud. 00:23:33.100 --> 00:23:35.890 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:23:35.890 --> 00:23:39.170 align:middle line:90% Chex, the classic taste. 00:23:39.170 --> 00:23:42.940 align:middle line:90% Chex, the classic crunch. 00:23:42.940 --> 00:23:48.850 align:middle line:84% The classic taste that can't be beat. 00:23:48.850 --> 00:23:54.110 align:middle line:84% The real taste of corn, rice and wheat. 00:23:54.110 --> 00:23:56.390 align:middle line:90% Chex, the classic crunch. 00:23:56.390 --> 00:23:58.610 align:middle line:84% This classic crunchy shape of Chex 00:23:58.610 --> 00:24:02.540 align:middle line:84% lets the milk burst through, and the timeless taste stay in. 00:24:02.540 --> 00:24:04.040 align:middle line:90% Chex, the classic crush. 00:24:04.040 --> 00:24:06.540 align:middle line:90% 00:24:06.540 --> 00:24:07.040 align:middle line:90% . 00:24:07.040 --> 00:24:11.342 align:middle line:84% Think is there only one choice for office Typewriters? 00:24:11.342 --> 00:24:13.652 align:middle line:90% Think again. 00:24:13.652 --> 00:24:14.570 align:middle line:90% Think Canon. 00:24:14.570 --> 00:24:17.210 align:middle line:84% Canon Typewriters are sturdy and reliable. 00:24:17.210 --> 00:24:21.260 align:middle line:84% With text editing power and speed, and custom features 00:24:21.260 --> 00:24:25.200 align:middle line:84% that make all your office work effortlessly beautiful. 00:24:25.200 --> 00:24:28.095 align:middle line:84% So if you think there's only one choice for office typewriters, 00:24:28.095 --> 00:24:30.910 align:middle line:84% think again, it pays to think twice. 00:24:30.910 --> 00:24:32.290 align:middle line:90% Think Canon. 00:24:32.290 --> 00:24:34.486 align:middle line:90% Think again. 00:24:34.486 --> 00:24:35.410 align:middle line:90% Think Canon. 00:24:35.410 --> 00:24:38.190 align:middle line:90% 00:24:38.190 --> 00:24:38.850 align:middle line:90% Let's rock. 00:24:38.850 --> 00:24:44.160 align:middle line:90% 00:24:44.160 --> 00:24:47.140 align:middle line:84% Given the extraordinary everchanging selection 00:24:47.140 --> 00:24:50.560 align:middle line:84% of fresh foods on our all you can eat, freshtastiks food bar. 00:24:50.560 --> 00:24:53.760 align:middle line:90% 00:24:53.760 --> 00:24:55.680 align:middle line:90% Who she can't please everyone. 00:24:55.680 --> 00:24:58.320 align:middle line:90% 00:24:58.320 --> 00:25:00.900 align:middle line:84% The you-can-eat freshtastik food bar. 00:25:00.900 --> 00:25:02.790 align:middle line:90% Free with every dinner. 00:25:02.790 --> 00:25:04.185 align:middle line:90% Only at bonanza. 00:25:04.185 --> 00:25:08.550 align:middle line:90% 00:25:08.550 --> 00:25:13.200 align:middle line:84% Qbee the 2bee bringing you beautiful true blue TV delight. 00:25:13.200 --> 00:25:17.040 align:middle line:84% QB the 2B I love what you do because you bring me Nick 00:25:17.040 --> 00:25:19.780 align:middle line:90% At Night. 00:25:19.780 --> 00:25:22.940 align:middle line:84% Now you get a little sense of what 00:25:22.940 --> 00:25:27.950 align:middle line:84% we were doing in the late 80s in New York City animation. 00:25:27.950 --> 00:25:30.920 align:middle line:84% Film is incredibly collaborative. 00:25:30.920 --> 00:25:36.200 align:middle line:84% The Check's commercial, we had 15 artists 00:25:36.200 --> 00:25:38.870 align:middle line:90% emulating Norman Rockwell. 00:25:38.870 --> 00:25:42.380 align:middle line:84% The director shot all of that footage 00:25:42.380 --> 00:25:45.380 align:middle line:84% with costume models, cast to look 00:25:45.380 --> 00:25:47.570 align:middle line:84% like the people in the paintings. 00:25:47.570 --> 00:25:49.700 align:middle line:84% And then we dismantled the footage, 00:25:49.700 --> 00:25:55.340 align:middle line:84% and blew up prints of each frame and paint it on the frames. 00:25:55.340 --> 00:25:59.430 align:middle line:84% The Stop Motion commercial, that's all plastic food. 00:25:59.430 --> 00:26:05.120 align:middle line:84% That's all food that we cast, and sculpted, and painted, 00:26:05.120 --> 00:26:06.470 align:middle line:90% and made. 00:26:06.470 --> 00:26:11.360 align:middle line:84% And the animator-- that was 18 hours straight that he 00:26:11.360 --> 00:26:13.220 align:middle line:90% shot that spot. 00:26:13.220 --> 00:26:19.100 align:middle line:84% He went on to become the head of animation at Sony Pictures. 00:26:19.100 --> 00:26:22.710 align:middle line:84% And people went on to other things, 00:26:22.710 --> 00:26:26.780 align:middle line:84% but it was incredible, incredible experience 00:26:26.780 --> 00:26:29.420 align:middle line:90% and with amazing people. 00:26:29.420 --> 00:26:32.690 align:middle line:84% At about that time, I was getting so much work 00:26:32.690 --> 00:26:36.470 align:middle line:84% and I was having people come work in my apartment, which was 00:26:36.470 --> 00:26:38.690 align:middle line:90% very annoying to my landlady. 00:26:38.690 --> 00:26:43.850 align:middle line:84% So I ended up renting studio space on Union Square. 00:26:43.850 --> 00:26:46.130 align:middle line:84% The building on the left is my building. 00:26:46.130 --> 00:26:52.250 align:middle line:84% I was on the top floor, the arched windows and my view 00:26:52.250 --> 00:26:55.820 align:middle line:84% was the view on the right, out those arched windows. 00:26:55.820 --> 00:27:00.450 align:middle line:84% And I don't think I appreciated it at the time. 00:27:00.450 --> 00:27:04.430 align:middle line:84% But it was a great location, and it was very official, 00:27:04.430 --> 00:27:09.740 align:middle line:84% and I was a serious person at that point. 00:27:09.740 --> 00:27:13.520 align:middle line:84% About that time, I got a call to go to New Mexico. 00:27:13.520 --> 00:27:16.340 align:middle line:84% The same director that had worked on the Burger King 00:27:16.340 --> 00:27:19.250 align:middle line:84% commercial with, that had given me the heads up on the ink 00:27:19.250 --> 00:27:23.390 align:middle line:84% tank, was shooting a film in Southern New Mexico 00:27:23.390 --> 00:27:25.230 align:middle line:90% and remembered I was from there. 00:27:25.230 --> 00:27:27.410 align:middle line:84% And we had a few meetings, and I ended up 00:27:27.410 --> 00:27:30.500 align:middle line:84% doing all of the production design. 00:27:30.500 --> 00:27:36.740 align:middle line:84% Choosing the costumes, hiring the scenic, finding cars. 00:27:36.740 --> 00:27:42.280 align:middle line:84% This was before cell phones in the middle of New Mexico. 00:27:42.280 --> 00:27:44.510 align:middle line:90% It was pretty challenging. 00:27:44.510 --> 00:27:45.570 align:middle line:90% It was amazing. 00:27:45.570 --> 00:27:48.620 align:middle line:84% It was-- it took six months to shoot-- 00:27:48.620 --> 00:27:51.480 align:middle line:84% to get everything together and shoot everything. 00:27:51.480 --> 00:27:56.030 align:middle line:84% And eventually the film got released. 00:27:56.030 --> 00:28:00.410 align:middle line:84% The director of photography, I think the next project 00:28:00.410 --> 00:28:04.520 align:middle line:84% for him was sling blade, it was not 00:28:04.520 --> 00:28:05.750 align:middle line:90% the first movie I worked on. 00:28:05.750 --> 00:28:08.210 align:middle line:84% I had already worked on three or four movies 00:28:08.210 --> 00:28:12.020 align:middle line:84% in the set department, and doing pre-production for movies. 00:28:12.020 --> 00:28:15.140 align:middle line:84% So it wasn't like out of the blue. 00:28:15.140 --> 00:28:19.090 align:middle line:84% I got a call the last month I was in New Mexico 00:28:19.090 --> 00:28:22.330 align:middle line:84% from someone I worked with at an effects firm, 00:28:22.330 --> 00:28:25.120 align:middle line:84% and he was telling me that, I was 00:28:25.120 --> 00:28:27.910 align:middle line:84% going to want to work on the next project he had 00:28:27.910 --> 00:28:31.100 align:middle line:84% and that I should call him the minute I got back to New York. 00:28:31.100 --> 00:28:33.070 align:middle line:90% And so I did. 00:28:33.070 --> 00:28:33.640 align:middle line:90% Heads up. 00:28:33.640 --> 00:28:36.430 align:middle line:84% This is what a personal computer, desktop 00:28:36.430 --> 00:28:37.990 align:middle line:90% looked like at this point. 00:28:37.990 --> 00:28:44.130 align:middle line:84% This is 1991 and I was going to get super familiar with this. 00:28:44.130 --> 00:28:46.590 align:middle line:90% I also owned a Newton. 00:28:46.590 --> 00:28:49.260 align:middle line:90% Just fun fact. 00:28:49.260 --> 00:28:54.720 align:middle line:84% The project he called me on was a CD interactive. 00:28:54.720 --> 00:28:57.310 align:middle line:90% They really don't exist anymore. 00:28:57.310 --> 00:29:02.980 align:middle line:84% We used to call it the eight track of the 90s. 00:29:02.980 --> 00:29:08.350 align:middle line:84% We were licensed to do Flintstones, Jetsons Time Warp. 00:29:08.350 --> 00:29:11.187 align:middle line:84% Fred Flintstone went to George Jetsons' world, 00:29:11.187 --> 00:29:13.270 align:middle line:84% George Jetston him went to Fred Flintstones world. 00:29:13.270 --> 00:29:15.880 align:middle line:84% It's basically an explorer game where you just 00:29:15.880 --> 00:29:19.210 align:middle line:84% clicked on everything you possibly could and animations 00:29:19.210 --> 00:29:20.650 align:middle line:90% would happen. 00:29:20.650 --> 00:29:25.590 align:middle line:84% And right as we were finishing that job, 00:29:25.590 --> 00:29:27.990 align:middle line:84% I got called by a friend who was working 00:29:27.990 --> 00:29:35.130 align:middle line:84% at AT&T on a super secret, top secret, interactive television 00:29:35.130 --> 00:29:36.150 align:middle line:90% trial. 00:29:36.150 --> 00:29:39.120 align:middle line:84% We weren't allowed to tell anybody what we were doing. 00:29:39.120 --> 00:29:40.770 align:middle line:90% I worked here for three years. 00:29:40.770 --> 00:29:42.910 align:middle line:90% No one knew what I was doing. 00:29:42.910 --> 00:29:45.000 align:middle line:84% And when I showed up for work, I saw 00:29:45.000 --> 00:29:46.920 align:middle line:84% a lot of people that had disappeared 00:29:46.920 --> 00:29:49.200 align:middle line:84% from the freelance scene and realized 00:29:49.200 --> 00:29:53.130 align:middle line:84% they were all here in this building in lower Manhattan, 00:29:53.130 --> 00:29:55.710 align:middle line:84% inventing interactive television. 00:29:55.710 --> 00:29:58.150 align:middle line:90% There was probably 100 people. 00:29:58.150 --> 00:30:00.360 align:middle line:90% 25 people in the art department. 00:30:00.360 --> 00:30:02.610 align:middle line:90% About 30 programmers. 00:30:02.610 --> 00:30:04.120 align:middle line:90% Everyone was really great. 00:30:04.120 --> 00:30:06.870 align:middle line:84% It was a really great group of people to work with. 00:30:06.870 --> 00:30:10.890 align:middle line:84% I designed for computer generated 00:30:10.890 --> 00:30:13.530 align:middle line:90% imagery, The Fantasy Baseball. 00:30:13.530 --> 00:30:16.200 align:middle line:90% We were the sports team. 00:30:16.200 --> 00:30:20.010 align:middle line:84% Our team was the only team that finished our application 00:30:20.010 --> 00:30:26.700 align:middle line:84% and had it up on the server just in time for the whole project 00:30:26.700 --> 00:30:28.890 align:middle line:90% to be canceled. 00:30:28.890 --> 00:30:31.160 align:middle line:90% So the project was canceled. 00:30:31.160 --> 00:30:32.870 align:middle line:90% We had one last party. 00:30:32.870 --> 00:30:34.970 align:middle line:90% We couldn't bring spouses. 00:30:34.970 --> 00:30:36.740 align:middle line:90% We could only have one drink. 00:30:36.740 --> 00:30:41.540 align:middle line:84% And so almost as a goof, we all decided to dress up, 00:30:41.540 --> 00:30:46.070 align:middle line:84% crazy dress up, to make it the best hilarious party we 00:30:46.070 --> 00:30:46.580 align:middle line:90% possibly . 00:30:46.580 --> 00:30:47.080 align:middle line:90% Could. 00:30:47.080 --> 00:30:49.910 align:middle line:90% 00:30:49.910 --> 00:30:52.990 align:middle line:84% The woman on the left ended up being my producer 00:30:52.990 --> 00:30:55.660 align:middle line:90% for the next 10 years. 00:30:55.660 --> 00:30:57.550 align:middle line:84% What happened was, we were all still getting 00:30:57.550 --> 00:31:00.800 align:middle line:84% our day rate and the people who hired us weren't there to fire 00:31:00.800 --> 00:31:01.300 align:middle line:90% us. 00:31:01.300 --> 00:31:03.760 align:middle line:84% So there were people still showing up every day 00:31:03.760 --> 00:31:06.610 align:middle line:84% and clocking in and getting their day rate, which 00:31:06.610 --> 00:31:08.720 align:middle line:90% seemed appropriate at the time. 00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:12.100 align:middle line:84% And at one point, the programmer that working on my project 00:31:12.100 --> 00:31:12.800 align:middle line:90% pulled me aside. 00:31:12.800 --> 00:31:16.090 align:middle line:84% He goes, we still have clients and I said like who, 00:31:16.090 --> 00:31:18.490 align:middle line:90% and he said, NFL. 00:31:18.490 --> 00:31:20.590 align:middle line:84% So we have to give them something. 00:31:20.590 --> 00:31:25.960 align:middle line:84% So we invented this game called Two Minute Warning. 00:31:25.960 --> 00:31:28.120 align:middle line:90% This is HTML one. 00:31:28.120 --> 00:31:32.440 align:middle line:84% And by doing this game, the programmer 00:31:32.440 --> 00:31:37.210 align:middle line:84% taught me how to do the HTML markup language. 00:31:37.210 --> 00:31:40.400 align:middle line:84% It's not-- and he told me this isn't a programming language, 00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:41.560 align:middle line:90% It's a markup. 00:31:41.560 --> 00:31:44.650 align:middle line:84% And it actually reminded me of specking type. 00:31:44.650 --> 00:31:47.320 align:middle line:90% That was not WYSIWYG programs. 00:31:47.320 --> 00:31:49.660 align:middle line:84% On the right you see, you literally 00:31:49.660 --> 00:31:51.160 align:middle line:90% had to type everything. 00:31:51.160 --> 00:31:54.640 align:middle line:84% You had to know what all those tags meant or nothing would 00:31:54.640 --> 00:31:57.340 align:middle line:84% work and you'd go back and forth to your browser 00:31:57.340 --> 00:31:59.470 align:middle line:84% to see if things were working and it 00:31:59.470 --> 00:32:03.710 align:middle line:84% was really interesting way to learn HTML but we did it. 00:32:03.710 --> 00:32:06.220 align:middle line:90% So now it's 1995. 00:32:06.220 --> 00:32:12.040 align:middle line:84% Left there and got work on a desktop computer game. 00:32:12.040 --> 00:32:15.850 align:middle line:84% This is how far things had come in just a few years. 00:32:15.850 --> 00:32:18.200 align:middle line:90% [INAUDIBLE] a CD Rom. 00:32:18.200 --> 00:32:19.360 align:middle line:90% It's gearheads. 00:32:19.360 --> 00:32:20.350 align:middle line:90% It's a twitch game. 00:32:20.350 --> 00:32:22.990 align:middle line:90% 00:32:22.990 --> 00:32:24.610 align:middle line:90% I subcontracted. 00:32:24.610 --> 00:32:28.660 align:middle line:84% So my company did all of the animation, the graphics, 00:32:28.660 --> 00:32:32.350 align:middle line:90% the logo, the interface design. 00:32:32.350 --> 00:32:35.410 align:middle line:84% I had a team of five people working on my, 00:32:35.410 --> 00:32:40.960 align:middle line:84% end and RJA had probably 20 programmers 00:32:40.960 --> 00:32:42.760 align:middle line:90% doing the programming. 00:32:42.760 --> 00:32:46.810 align:middle line:84% I animated all the explosions and E 2D effects, 00:32:46.810 --> 00:32:49.450 align:middle line:84% and did the color design as well. 00:32:49.450 --> 00:32:50.680 align:middle line:90% And it did really well. 00:32:50.680 --> 00:32:55.210 align:middle line:84% It got really good reviews, but it only worked on desktop. 00:32:55.210 --> 00:32:59.270 align:middle line:84% I saw it five years later in a $2 bin 00:32:59.270 --> 00:33:01.960 align:middle line:90% at a Rite Aid or something. 00:33:01.960 --> 00:33:05.170 align:middle line:90% But it was a good experience. 00:33:05.170 --> 00:33:09.370 align:middle line:84% The logo was done by my friend, Laura. 00:33:09.370 --> 00:33:11.890 align:middle line:84% Laura, I had worked with in animation. 00:33:11.890 --> 00:33:14.230 align:middle line:90% She had worked at AT&T. 00:33:14.230 --> 00:33:16.360 align:middle line:84% We called her in to do the logo on gearheads 00:33:16.360 --> 00:33:20.860 align:middle line:84% because she was such an amazing typographer. 00:33:20.860 --> 00:33:24.080 align:middle line:84% This is my leave behind that I would leave at the end. 00:33:24.080 --> 00:33:25.830 align:middle line:84% This was before I even had my own website. 00:33:25.830 --> 00:33:28.600 align:middle line:90% 00:33:28.600 --> 00:33:32.120 align:middle line:90% This is for my studio. 00:33:32.120 --> 00:33:33.910 align:middle line:84% This is what a browser looked like. 00:33:33.910 --> 00:33:36.730 align:middle line:90% This is 96, 95, 96. 00:33:36.730 --> 00:33:38.800 align:middle line:84% This is what my website looked like. 00:33:38.800 --> 00:33:40.480 align:middle line:90% I had it in my actual website. 00:33:40.480 --> 00:33:44.940 align:middle line:90% 00:33:44.940 --> 00:33:47.070 align:middle line:90% And I had started pitching. 00:33:47.070 --> 00:33:49.110 align:middle line:84% I didn't want to work in advertising, 00:33:49.110 --> 00:33:52.110 align:middle line:84% and right away the internet turned into a place 00:33:52.110 --> 00:33:53.580 align:middle line:90% for advertising. 00:33:53.580 --> 00:33:58.600 align:middle line:84% And I started pitching projects to different companies. 00:33:58.600 --> 00:34:00.720 align:middle line:84% And my favorite place to go pitch 00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:02.730 align:middle line:84% was the Museum of Natural History. 00:34:02.730 --> 00:34:05.100 align:middle line:84% Because you could bring whatever idea. 00:34:05.100 --> 00:34:07.530 align:middle line:84% There was-- they really didn't even have a website yet. 00:34:07.530 --> 00:34:11.310 align:middle line:84% They just had their name at the top of the page 00:34:11.310 --> 00:34:16.139 align:middle line:84% and you could pitch to whoever, and have three hour discussion 00:34:16.139 --> 00:34:18.870 align:middle line:84% about intelligent life in the universe, 00:34:18.870 --> 00:34:21.630 align:middle line:90% and go look at all the dioramas. 00:34:21.630 --> 00:34:25.980 align:middle line:84% And it was really amazing and I loved the people there. 00:34:25.980 --> 00:34:28.080 align:middle line:90% This website is still-- 00:34:28.080 --> 00:34:30.210 align:middle line:84% they still use content from this website. 00:34:30.210 --> 00:34:35.429 align:middle line:84% It was one of the only early learner websites that they had. 00:34:35.429 --> 00:34:37.080 align:middle line:90% It was simple. 00:34:37.080 --> 00:34:39.540 align:middle line:84% Exploring nature activities and I 00:34:39.540 --> 00:34:44.550 align:middle line:84% worked with a friend of mine who taught second and third graders 00:34:44.550 --> 00:34:46.409 align:middle line:90% at Friends Seminary. 00:34:46.409 --> 00:34:49.620 align:middle line:84% My friend John is an incredible educator. 00:34:49.620 --> 00:34:55.080 align:middle line:84% And one of the projects we did was the subway system 00:34:55.080 --> 00:34:56.100 align:middle line:90% with his class. 00:34:56.100 --> 00:35:01.020 align:middle line:84% So 6 and 7 and 8-year-old kids helped me do this website. 00:35:01.020 --> 00:35:04.170 align:middle line:84% And they were really savvy, and they were asking me 00:35:04.170 --> 00:35:06.210 align:middle line:90% how much RAM my computer has. 00:35:06.210 --> 00:35:07.830 align:middle line:90% Something I'd never heard. 00:35:07.830 --> 00:35:10.710 align:middle line:90% 6, 7 and 8-year-old kids ask. 00:35:10.710 --> 00:35:13.440 align:middle line:84% But my favorite thing they were impressed by, 00:35:13.440 --> 00:35:16.770 align:middle line:84% they thought I was so cool because I could touch type 00:35:16.770 --> 00:35:18.840 align:middle line:90% and not look at the keyboard. 00:35:18.840 --> 00:35:20.940 align:middle line:84% And nothing like a seven-year-old telling you 00:35:20.940 --> 00:35:24.090 align:middle line:84% that it's cool that you could type. 00:35:24.090 --> 00:35:29.480 align:middle line:84% This is their interactive subway system. 00:35:29.480 --> 00:35:34.880 align:middle line:84% So one of the last animation jobs I did. 00:35:34.880 --> 00:35:38.390 align:middle line:84% Actually, the last broadcast animation job I did 00:35:38.390 --> 00:35:40.770 align:middle line:90% was this one. 00:35:40.770 --> 00:35:44.650 align:middle line:90% [MUSIC PLAYING] 00:35:44.650 --> 00:35:51.930 align:middle line:90% 00:35:51.930 --> 00:35:55.830 align:middle line:84% So that was pitched to me and it was pitched to Nick & Junior 00:35:55.830 --> 00:35:57.930 align:middle line:84% by my friend, Kalman, who I actually 00:35:57.930 --> 00:35:59.160 align:middle line:90% went to ArtCenter with. 00:35:59.160 --> 00:36:02.560 align:middle line:84% And he lives in La now and he's a filmmaker. 00:36:02.560 --> 00:36:07.970 align:middle line:84% We had so much fun reconnecting, and working together. 00:36:07.970 --> 00:36:09.980 align:middle line:84% I started getting a little burnt out. 00:36:09.980 --> 00:36:12.680 align:middle line:90% I had little kids. 00:36:12.680 --> 00:36:15.090 align:middle line:90% I just wasn't feeling it. 00:36:15.090 --> 00:36:17.240 align:middle line:84% I was still getting a lot of calls for work 00:36:17.240 --> 00:36:20.840 align:middle line:84% but I decided to close down my studio. 00:36:20.840 --> 00:36:22.400 align:middle line:90% I had saved a lot of money. 00:36:22.400 --> 00:36:25.490 align:middle line:84% And just put that aside and took some time 00:36:25.490 --> 00:36:27.860 align:middle line:90% to spend with my kids. 00:36:27.860 --> 00:36:36.120 align:middle line:84% And in my-- so basically I went back to the land. 00:36:36.120 --> 00:36:44.070 align:middle line:84% I started gardening, and doing programs with kids, and hiking, 00:36:44.070 --> 00:36:46.950 align:middle line:84% and foraging, and medicine making. 00:36:46.950 --> 00:36:51.930 align:middle line:84% I joined the Board of the Conservancy in my town. 00:36:51.930 --> 00:36:57.720 align:middle line:84% And we were basically taking out invasive plants and planting 00:36:57.720 --> 00:37:01.350 align:middle line:84% and new plants, and learning about trees 00:37:01.350 --> 00:37:03.930 align:middle line:84% and cultivating the wildflower preserve, 00:37:03.930 --> 00:37:08.360 align:middle line:84% and it was really a great experience. 00:37:08.360 --> 00:37:12.560 align:middle line:84% Around the time, I decided to take an illustration 00:37:12.560 --> 00:37:15.050 align:middle line:84% class because I thought, well, wouldn't it 00:37:15.050 --> 00:37:18.260 align:middle line:84% be nice to learn watercolor and paint flowers, 00:37:18.260 --> 00:37:23.070 align:middle line:84% and I took a class from my friend, Mindy Lighthipe. 00:37:23.070 --> 00:37:24.960 align:middle line:84% And we became really good friends. 00:37:24.960 --> 00:37:26.730 align:middle line:90% Her studio was in the next town. 00:37:26.730 --> 00:37:28.260 align:middle line:90% She had open studios. 00:37:28.260 --> 00:37:32.970 align:middle line:84% We spent days and days and days just finding things to draw. 00:37:32.970 --> 00:37:36.480 align:middle line:84% She was a person that I could just go and pull up mushrooms 00:37:36.480 --> 00:37:39.840 align:middle line:84% with, and throw them on a table and paint them. 00:37:39.840 --> 00:37:42.300 align:middle line:84% And she introduced me to the woman 00:37:42.300 --> 00:37:45.390 align:middle line:84% at the bottom of the screen, Patricia [INAUDIBLE],, who 00:37:45.390 --> 00:37:47.400 align:middle line:84% worked at the Museum in Natural History, 00:37:47.400 --> 00:37:54.300 align:middle line:84% and she's been a freelance Illustrator there for 40 years. 00:37:54.300 --> 00:37:55.860 align:middle line:90% She's freelance. 00:37:55.860 --> 00:37:56.910 align:middle line:90% She's contract. 00:37:56.910 --> 00:37:59.100 align:middle line:90% And they gave her an office. 00:37:59.100 --> 00:38:02.010 align:middle line:84% If you go in the mammillary department 00:38:02.010 --> 00:38:04.410 align:middle line:84% at the Museum of Natural History where the offices 00:38:04.410 --> 00:38:05.910 align:middle line:90% are, where the scientists work. 00:38:05.910 --> 00:38:10.170 align:middle line:84% Every single piece of artwork on the walls is something she did. 00:38:10.170 --> 00:38:13.180 align:middle line:90% She's an amazing person. 00:38:13.180 --> 00:38:17.960 align:middle line:84% And she's talked me into joining-- 00:38:17.960 --> 00:38:19.430 align:middle line:84% these are some of the illustrations 00:38:19.430 --> 00:38:23.820 align:middle line:90% I did in the years after that. 00:38:23.820 --> 00:38:27.720 align:middle line:84% And I joined the Guild of Natural Science Illustrators. 00:38:27.720 --> 00:38:32.280 align:middle line:84% And I got a job, and the person who recommended me for this job 00:38:32.280 --> 00:38:34.140 align:middle line:90% was my friend, Laura. 00:38:34.140 --> 00:38:36.420 align:middle line:84% The person who had worked at AT&T. Who 00:38:36.420 --> 00:38:37.980 align:middle line:90% did the Gearheads logo. 00:38:37.980 --> 00:38:42.240 align:middle line:84% Had moved to North Carolina and was working at Algonquin. 00:38:42.240 --> 00:38:44.220 align:middle line:90% And they were having trouble. 00:38:44.220 --> 00:38:46.470 align:middle line:84% They were using a photograph of a snail 00:38:46.470 --> 00:38:50.110 align:middle line:84% and she emailed it to me and she says, what's wrong with this? 00:38:50.110 --> 00:38:52.410 align:middle line:84% And I said, well they filled the photograph 00:38:52.410 --> 00:38:56.140 align:middle line:84% because the spiral on the shell is going the wrong direction. 00:38:56.140 --> 00:38:58.800 align:middle line:84% And she had the creative director call me. 00:38:58.800 --> 00:39:00.120 align:middle line:90% She goes OK. 00:39:00.120 --> 00:39:02.700 align:middle line:84% And I said it's not the species that's mentioned 00:39:02.700 --> 00:39:04.290 align:middle line:90% in the manuscript, et cetera. 00:39:04.290 --> 00:39:07.530 align:middle line:84% So they hired me to do the cover of this book. 00:39:07.530 --> 00:39:11.370 align:middle line:84% And it was just a beautiful memoir 00:39:11.370 --> 00:39:16.800 align:middle line:84% about a woman's chronic illness, and how she dealt with it 00:39:16.800 --> 00:39:18.690 align:middle line:90% by slowing her life down. 00:39:18.690 --> 00:39:23.310 align:middle line:84% And metaphorically, someone had given her a snail 00:39:23.310 --> 00:39:26.970 align:middle line:84% and the title alludes to the sound 00:39:26.970 --> 00:39:29.920 align:middle line:84% of the snail chewing on leave in the middle of the night. 00:39:29.920 --> 00:39:32.420 align:middle line:90% She could hear it eating. 00:39:32.420 --> 00:39:34.830 align:middle line:90% And it's a beautiful book. 00:39:34.830 --> 00:39:38.300 align:middle line:84% I don't think Algonquin thought it would do as well as it did. 00:39:38.300 --> 00:39:41.570 align:middle line:90% It did very, very well. 00:39:41.570 --> 00:39:44.150 align:middle line:84% I also added a fern for the paperback, 00:39:44.150 --> 00:39:45.900 align:middle line:90% and it's all over the world. 00:39:45.900 --> 00:39:49.730 align:middle line:84% There's no market that this book isn't still in print. 00:39:49.730 --> 00:39:51.560 align:middle line:84% That was a really nice experience. 00:39:51.560 --> 00:39:54.710 align:middle line:84% And I'm actually good friends with Elizabeth now. 00:39:54.710 --> 00:39:57.320 align:middle line:84% I continue to do natural science illustration, 00:39:57.320 --> 00:39:59.330 align:middle line:84% and Patricia [INAUDIBLE] tricked me 00:39:59.330 --> 00:40:01.370 align:middle line:84% into joining the Selma Ganghi Club. 00:40:01.370 --> 00:40:04.220 align:middle line:90% An art club in New York City. 00:40:04.220 --> 00:40:06.290 align:middle line:90% We do monotypes. 00:40:06.290 --> 00:40:07.790 align:middle line:90% I'm doing one tomorrow night. 00:40:07.790 --> 00:40:10.250 align:middle line:84% I have monotype parties once a month. 00:40:10.250 --> 00:40:13.040 align:middle line:84% I've met many, many, many more of my people. 00:40:13.040 --> 00:40:15.980 align:middle line:84% Every single person in that photograph on the lower left 00:40:15.980 --> 00:40:18.260 align:middle line:90% is a printmaker. 00:40:18.260 --> 00:40:19.560 align:middle line:90% It's just a joy. 00:40:19.560 --> 00:40:23.600 align:middle line:84% I was the chairman for the Junior Scholarship Committee. 00:40:23.600 --> 00:40:27.050 align:middle line:90% So artists age 21 to 35. 00:40:27.050 --> 00:40:30.470 align:middle line:84% We get special membership rates for this club 00:40:30.470 --> 00:40:35.980 align:middle line:84% and have their own exhibits twice a year. 00:40:35.980 --> 00:40:39.130 align:middle line:84% I continue to do natural science illustration. 00:40:39.130 --> 00:40:43.030 align:middle line:84% I go to the museum once a month, and sketch with Patricia 00:40:43.030 --> 00:40:46.050 align:middle line:90% after hours. 00:40:46.050 --> 00:40:51.480 align:middle line:84% And then Forager came last year, and I was really, really happy. 00:40:51.480 --> 00:40:54.750 align:middle line:84% Again, Laura recommended me to the new creative director 00:40:54.750 --> 00:40:56.820 align:middle line:90% at Algonquin. 00:40:56.820 --> 00:40:59.290 align:middle line:84% And the project just sounded amazing. 00:40:59.290 --> 00:41:01.590 align:middle line:90% I was a little too eager. 00:41:01.590 --> 00:41:06.750 align:middle line:84% I should probably have negotiated a little bit more. 00:41:06.750 --> 00:41:09.630 align:middle line:84% They didn't assign me a scientist 00:41:09.630 --> 00:41:11.880 align:middle line:84% to vet the work, which is interesting 00:41:11.880 --> 00:41:13.590 align:middle line:84% but I had access to a lot of people 00:41:13.590 --> 00:41:16.680 align:middle line:84% that could look and tell me if I'd gotten anything wrong. 00:41:16.680 --> 00:41:20.150 align:middle line:90% I worked in pencil. 00:41:20.150 --> 00:41:21.640 align:middle line:90% The turnaround time was tight. 00:41:21.640 --> 00:41:23.980 align:middle line:90% There were 17 illustrations. 00:41:23.980 --> 00:41:28.720 align:middle line:84% I had a month to do the pencils, and a month to do finals. 00:41:28.720 --> 00:41:33.770 align:middle line:84% And I-- the creative director and I had a great relationship. 00:41:33.770 --> 00:41:35.340 align:middle line:84% We never even talked on the phone. 00:41:35.340 --> 00:41:36.340 align:middle line:90% I think we just emailed. 00:41:36.340 --> 00:41:38.950 align:middle line:90% 00:41:38.950 --> 00:41:41.830 align:middle line:90% I fed him a few at a time. 00:41:41.830 --> 00:41:44.890 align:middle line:84% I didn't want to do 17 illustrations and then find out 00:41:44.890 --> 00:41:46.120 align:middle line:90% they were wrong. 00:41:46.120 --> 00:41:49.570 align:middle line:84% So I fed him five at a time, or three at a time. 00:41:49.570 --> 00:41:53.170 align:middle line:84% And he didn't ask for any changes, which made 00:41:53.170 --> 00:41:55.720 align:middle line:90% me really super suspicious. 00:41:55.720 --> 00:41:59.320 align:middle line:84% But-- and he kept saying, and then you'll add your flair. 00:41:59.320 --> 00:42:03.400 align:middle line:84% And I didn't know what he was talking about. 00:42:03.400 --> 00:42:06.580 align:middle line:84% But I-- So I just did what I did and I 00:42:06.580 --> 00:42:11.260 align:middle line:84% guess I added my flair because there were no changes. 00:42:11.260 --> 00:42:14.158 align:middle line:84% Actually, he did he did make some suggestions 00:42:14.158 --> 00:42:15.700 align:middle line:84% on some of the layouts and I actually 00:42:15.700 --> 00:42:17.080 align:middle line:90% used all his suggestions. 00:42:17.080 --> 00:42:18.580 align:middle line:90% They were really good. 00:42:18.580 --> 00:42:21.980 align:middle line:84% So as you can see, these appear to be, 00:42:21.980 --> 00:42:26.470 align:middle line:84% which is what the contracted ink drawings. 00:42:26.470 --> 00:42:28.360 align:middle line:84% And I actually am a really good inker. 00:42:28.360 --> 00:42:31.150 align:middle line:84% I can work on Bristol, but it was a tight schedule, 00:42:31.150 --> 00:42:33.520 align:middle line:90% so I made a Photoshop brush. 00:42:33.520 --> 00:42:37.510 align:middle line:84% I actually inked the entire thing in Photoshop. 00:42:37.510 --> 00:42:40.850 align:middle line:90% 00:42:40.850 --> 00:42:44.020 align:middle line:90% So there are 17 illustrations. 00:42:44.020 --> 00:42:46.460 align:middle line:90% Show 9 here. 00:42:46.460 --> 00:42:51.040 align:middle line:84% Right here's my advice, everybody. 00:42:51.040 --> 00:42:54.230 align:middle line:84% Obviously, I'll take some questions. 00:42:54.230 --> 00:42:59.860 align:middle line:84% Anyone who's doing any kind of freelance, or selling design. 00:42:59.860 --> 00:43:03.040 align:middle line:84% Get this book because it tells you what the going 00:43:03.040 --> 00:43:05.320 align:middle line:90% rate is for everything. 00:43:05.320 --> 00:43:10.420 align:middle line:84% Everything from fabric design, to spot illustration, 00:43:10.420 --> 00:43:12.970 align:middle line:84% to a cover illustration, to a magazine illustration, 00:43:12.970 --> 00:43:15.400 align:middle line:84% to a local newspaper illustration. 00:43:15.400 --> 00:43:17.650 align:middle line:90% It's worth getting. 00:43:17.650 --> 00:43:20.110 align:middle line:90% Get this book. 00:43:20.110 --> 00:43:22.150 align:middle line:90% All of these links-- 00:43:22.150 --> 00:43:26.125 align:middle line:84% I have a link that I'll put in the chat on my website. 00:43:26.125 --> 00:43:27.160 align:middle line:90% You don't need to-- 00:43:27.160 --> 00:43:30.820 align:middle line:84% You could do a screenshot if you want, but these are all-- 00:43:30.820 --> 00:43:32.060 align:middle line:90% find your people. 00:43:32.060 --> 00:43:32.900 align:middle line:90% Find your people. 00:43:32.900 --> 00:43:34.270 align:middle line:90% Find your people. 00:43:34.270 --> 00:43:38.660 align:middle line:84% You are a strange animal if you're an Illustrator 00:43:38.660 --> 00:43:41.680 align:middle line:84% or if you're an artist and you need to be around other people 00:43:41.680 --> 00:43:42.460 align:middle line:90% like you. 00:43:42.460 --> 00:43:44.900 align:middle line:84% You don't want to reinvent the wheel. 00:43:44.900 --> 00:43:47.380 align:middle line:84% You don't want to wonder what you should be 00:43:47.380 --> 00:43:48.640 align:middle line:90% charging for an illustration. 00:43:48.640 --> 00:43:49.510 align:middle line:90% You get that book. 00:43:49.510 --> 00:43:54.760 align:middle line:84% You don't want to wonder what's the best gouache. 00:43:54.760 --> 00:43:55.810 align:middle line:90% Meet people. 00:43:55.810 --> 00:43:57.640 align:middle line:90% Go to meetups. 00:43:57.640 --> 00:44:01.300 align:middle line:90% Go to-- volunteer. 00:44:01.300 --> 00:44:03.610 align:middle line:84% There are so many people that have volunteered 00:44:03.610 --> 00:44:07.390 align:middle line:84% at the SCBWI conventions that now have books 00:44:07.390 --> 00:44:10.570 align:middle line:90% because they learn so much. 00:44:10.570 --> 00:44:13.000 align:middle line:84% The Guild of Natural Science Illustrators 00:44:13.000 --> 00:44:15.100 align:middle line:84% is another really good organization 00:44:15.100 --> 00:44:16.990 align:middle line:90% if there's a local chapter. 00:44:16.990 --> 00:44:19.210 align:middle line:84% People love to share information, 00:44:19.210 --> 00:44:22.000 align:middle line:84% and you want to be around people that share their information. 00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:24.160 align:middle line:84% If you ask someone how they did something 00:44:24.160 --> 00:44:27.430 align:middle line:84% and they don't tell you, that's lame. 00:44:27.430 --> 00:44:30.370 align:middle line:84% You tell them-- you tell them how you did it 00:44:30.370 --> 00:44:35.010 align:middle line:84% and always pay it forward if someone helps you out. 00:44:35.010 --> 00:44:37.860 align:middle line:84% Closer to home, I know you guys are in LA. 00:44:37.860 --> 00:44:40.680 align:middle line:84% There's a Society of Illustrators of Los Angeles, 00:44:40.680 --> 00:44:43.560 align:middle line:90% the most cumbersome name ever. 00:44:43.560 --> 00:44:45.720 align:middle line:84% Their website could use a little help, 00:44:45.720 --> 00:44:47.405 align:middle line:84% but it's a really good organization. 00:44:47.405 --> 00:44:48.780 align:middle line:84% They're really nice people, and I 00:44:48.780 --> 00:44:51.750 align:middle line:90% think Brad Holland is a member. 00:44:51.750 --> 00:44:54.210 align:middle line:84% And also meet up, not in a creepy way, 00:44:54.210 --> 00:44:59.460 align:middle line:84% and sorry for repeating world wide web twice, but made up 00:44:59.460 --> 00:45:05.220 align:middle line:84% is a- be specific when you do your searches. 00:45:05.220 --> 00:45:07.530 align:middle line:84% I found life drawing people that want 00:45:07.530 --> 00:45:09.330 align:middle line:90% to go out and sketch in parks. 00:45:09.330 --> 00:45:11.910 align:middle line:84% People that want to go to museums. 00:45:11.910 --> 00:45:13.020 align:middle line:90% Other people. 00:45:13.020 --> 00:45:14.145 align:middle line:90% That's what you want to do. 00:45:14.145 --> 00:45:17.710 align:middle line:90% 00:45:17.710 --> 00:45:19.360 align:middle line:90% Thank you, Susan. 00:45:19.360 --> 00:45:21.070 align:middle line:84% I want to make you aware that there 00:45:21.070 --> 00:45:24.610 align:middle line:84% are a lot of pops and kudos in the chat. 00:45:24.610 --> 00:45:25.620 align:middle line:90% Oh, thank you. 00:45:25.620 --> 00:45:28.790 align:middle line:84% You can definitely take a look at that. 00:45:28.790 --> 00:45:31.270 align:middle line:84% So I'm happy to ask any questions that you all 00:45:31.270 --> 00:45:35.980 align:middle line:84% have in the chat, but if anyone would like to share their own, 00:45:35.980 --> 00:45:37.720 align:middle line:84% would like to voice it, you're more than 00:45:37.720 --> 00:45:39.980 align:middle line:90% welcome to do that as well. 00:45:39.980 --> 00:45:44.300 align:middle line:84% Does anyone want to step up or should I hop into the chat? 00:45:44.300 --> 00:45:48.080 align:middle line:84% So Malik, Miss Brand, have you ever 00:45:48.080 --> 00:45:52.660 align:middle line:84% made an animation for a movie or a short film? 00:45:52.660 --> 00:45:56.888 align:middle line:90% But like for the entire movie? 00:45:56.888 --> 00:45:57.430 align:middle line:90% I don't know? 00:45:57.430 --> 00:45:58.700 align:middle line:90% Where's Malik? 00:45:58.700 --> 00:46:00.550 align:middle line:90% Malik? 00:46:00.550 --> 00:46:03.670 align:middle line:84% Can you clarify for us, Malik, if you don't mind. 00:46:03.670 --> 00:46:07.330 align:middle line:84% Oh, well, I meant for, have you made an animation 00:46:07.330 --> 00:46:09.790 align:middle line:90% for the entire movie? 00:46:09.790 --> 00:46:10.510 align:middle line:90% Oh, no. 00:46:10.510 --> 00:46:11.410 align:middle line:90% I haven't. 00:46:11.410 --> 00:46:12.890 align:middle line:90% No. 00:46:12.890 --> 00:46:15.500 align:middle line:90% That's like just so much work. 00:46:15.500 --> 00:46:19.700 align:middle line:84% If you got a job like that, then that's your life's work. 00:46:19.700 --> 00:46:21.710 align:middle line:84% I did a short film and it took me 00:46:21.710 --> 00:46:24.260 align:middle line:84% seven years of all of my spare time, 00:46:24.260 --> 00:46:26.450 align:middle line:90% and all of my spare money. 00:46:26.450 --> 00:46:32.630 align:middle line:84% Well well, are you are you currently doing animation now? 00:46:32.630 --> 00:46:34.370 align:middle line:90% I'm actually not. 00:46:34.370 --> 00:46:36.680 align:middle line:84% I'm doing-- I'm doing some gifts. 00:46:36.680 --> 00:46:38.210 align:middle line:90% I haven't-- I'm cured. 00:46:38.210 --> 00:46:41.780 align:middle line:84% I don't really want to do animation right now, 00:46:41.780 --> 00:46:44.780 align:middle line:90% but that could change. 00:46:44.780 --> 00:46:45.530 align:middle line:90% That could change. 00:46:45.530 --> 00:46:49.900 align:middle line:84% If I get inspired, I will definitely do animation. 00:46:49.900 --> 00:46:50.680 align:middle line:90% Thanks, Malik. 00:46:50.680 --> 00:46:52.490 align:middle line:90% Thank you, Susan. 00:46:52.490 --> 00:46:52.990 align:middle line:90% OK. 00:46:52.990 --> 00:46:53.740 align:middle line:90% Melanie. 00:46:53.740 --> 00:46:56.950 align:middle line:84% She said, have you ever worked on any projects that 00:46:56.950 --> 00:46:58.630 align:middle line:90% had a long narrative storyline? 00:46:58.630 --> 00:47:00.950 align:middle line:90% Like a story with characters. 00:47:00.950 --> 00:47:04.350 align:middle line:84% I am currently working on a graphic novel. 00:47:04.350 --> 00:47:09.250 align:middle line:84% It's like an early learner graphic novel, and it's about-- 00:47:09.250 --> 00:47:14.710 align:middle line:84% Yeah, it's long and it's tedious to work on. 00:47:14.710 --> 00:47:17.800 align:middle line:90% And I'm really enjoying it. 00:47:17.800 --> 00:47:19.960 align:middle line:84% Jasmine asks, how did you feel when 00:47:19.960 --> 00:47:21.430 align:middle line:90% you created your animation? 00:47:21.430 --> 00:47:24.280 align:middle line:84% How do you feel when you accomplish it? or-- 00:47:24.280 --> 00:47:27.320 align:middle line:90% It's kind of magical. 00:47:27.320 --> 00:47:33.460 align:middle line:84% I mean, it's a long process to animate by hand, 00:47:33.460 --> 00:47:36.100 align:middle line:84% even that last-- the hopping bunnies. 00:47:36.100 --> 00:47:39.130 align:middle line:84% That was entirely digital, but you're still 00:47:39.130 --> 00:47:42.910 align:middle line:84% literally animating every frame and making decisions 00:47:42.910 --> 00:47:43.870 align:middle line:90% on every frame. 00:47:43.870 --> 00:47:47.020 align:middle line:84% So it's really easy to get caught up in the minutia. 00:47:47.020 --> 00:47:48.880 align:middle line:90% It's really important to plan. 00:47:48.880 --> 00:47:52.210 align:middle line:84% If you don't have a storyboard, things fall apart. 00:47:52.210 --> 00:47:55.130 align:middle line:84% If you don't have your timings, things fall apart. 00:47:55.130 --> 00:47:59.840 align:middle line:84% It's-- any long term project really needs an outline, 00:47:59.840 --> 00:48:02.260 align:middle line:84% a skeleton, and then you work from there. 00:48:02.260 --> 00:48:06.430 align:middle line:84% You get-- and when I first started in animation, 00:48:06.430 --> 00:48:09.010 align:middle line:84% those storyboards had to be so nailed down 00:48:09.010 --> 00:48:11.800 align:middle line:84% because you were asking all these people to do 00:48:11.800 --> 00:48:14.290 align:middle line:84% all this work, and spending all this money. 00:48:14.290 --> 00:48:16.930 align:middle line:84% Every concept had to be so solid. 00:48:16.930 --> 00:48:19.990 align:middle line:84% And now you could just try things on your computer. 00:48:19.990 --> 00:48:23.440 align:middle line:84% That could be part of the reason why I'm just not as enchanted 00:48:23.440 --> 00:48:26.140 align:middle line:90% by animation these days. 00:48:26.140 --> 00:48:30.520 align:middle line:84% But it was always magical to see it and-- 00:48:30.520 --> 00:48:32.530 align:middle line:90% you kind of knew it inside out. 00:48:32.530 --> 00:48:34.570 align:middle line:84% Like you'd seen it a million times. 00:48:34.570 --> 00:48:36.200 align:middle line:90% You knew every single frame. 00:48:36.200 --> 00:48:38.380 align:middle line:90% So it was really great to do. 00:48:38.380 --> 00:48:41.020 align:middle line:84% There was actually one thing I left out 00:48:41.020 --> 00:48:43.900 align:middle line:84% the list is the organization, ASIFA. 00:48:43.900 --> 00:48:49.330 align:middle line:84% I know LA has got a big ASIFA constituent. 00:48:49.330 --> 00:48:53.170 align:middle line:84% But ASIFA East in New York, once a year, there's a Film Festival 00:48:53.170 --> 00:48:55.810 align:middle line:84% and you could show and we showed our commercials. 00:48:55.810 --> 00:48:58.120 align:middle line:84% And to see an audience watching it 00:48:58.120 --> 00:49:00.580 align:middle line:84% in a theater, that's when you realize, 00:49:00.580 --> 00:49:01.510 align:middle line:90% Oh, we did something. 00:49:01.510 --> 00:49:02.890 align:middle line:90% We did something interesting. 00:49:02.890 --> 00:49:04.270 align:middle line:90% We did something special. 00:49:04.270 --> 00:49:10.570 align:middle line:84% The Norman Rockwell piece was technologically astonishing. 00:49:10.570 --> 00:49:13.390 align:middle line:84% It won a CLIO award and it got a lot of attention 00:49:13.390 --> 00:49:16.120 align:middle line:90% for the studio that produced it. 00:49:16.120 --> 00:49:19.930 align:middle line:84% But we knew every frame of that by the time 00:49:19.930 --> 00:49:22.060 align:middle line:90% we saw it all together. 00:49:22.060 --> 00:49:25.000 align:middle line:84% So Yeah, it was it's magical, but a lot of it 00:49:25.000 --> 00:49:27.550 align:middle line:84% was like being in the trenches with other people making. 00:49:27.550 --> 00:49:30.530 align:middle line:90% 00:49:30.530 --> 00:49:31.030 align:middle line:90% Thanks. 00:49:31.030 --> 00:49:32.890 align:middle line:84% Charmaine, do you have a question? 00:49:32.890 --> 00:49:35.950 align:middle line:84% In your sketchbook, and from your presentation, 00:49:35.950 --> 00:49:39.070 align:middle line:84% you obviously have a lot of different kinds of art 00:49:39.070 --> 00:49:40.600 align:middle line:90% that you do. 00:49:40.600 --> 00:49:42.100 align:middle line:84% And I noticed in your sketchbook you 00:49:42.100 --> 00:49:44.500 align:middle line:84% have a lot of very detailed pen work, 00:49:44.500 --> 00:49:48.654 align:middle line:84% and then also a lot of very colorful loose landscaping. 00:49:48.654 --> 00:49:52.120 align:middle line:84% Some beautiful stuff, and then the monotype stuff. 00:49:52.120 --> 00:49:54.610 align:middle line:84% Do you have a current favorite or what 00:49:54.610 --> 00:49:56.800 align:middle line:84% you would go to if you weren't doing something 00:49:56.800 --> 00:49:59.620 align:middle line:84% for a commission or for work but would just sit down 00:49:59.620 --> 00:50:00.670 align:middle line:90% and do it for fun. 00:50:00.670 --> 00:50:02.470 align:middle line:90% Do you have a current favorite? 00:50:02.470 --> 00:50:07.300 align:middle line:84% My current favorite is kind of semi tight oil painting. 00:50:07.300 --> 00:50:09.370 align:middle line:84% I've been doing a lot of still lives. 00:50:09.370 --> 00:50:12.940 align:middle line:84% When I look at the base of it and the colorist when I paint, 00:50:12.940 --> 00:50:14.080 align:middle line:90% and so it's-- 00:50:14.080 --> 00:50:16.480 align:middle line:90% I'm looking at light and form. 00:50:16.480 --> 00:50:18.730 align:middle line:84% And sometimes I want to paint really tight, 00:50:18.730 --> 00:50:21.730 align:middle line:84% but sometimes I like something loose. 00:50:21.730 --> 00:50:23.380 align:middle line:84% A lot of the time, loose paintings 00:50:23.380 --> 00:50:25.360 align:middle line:84% are sketches for tighter paintings, 00:50:25.360 --> 00:50:28.000 align:middle line:90% like they're more concept art. 00:50:28.000 --> 00:50:31.600 align:middle line:84% But when I was working in illustration, 00:50:31.600 --> 00:50:34.900 align:middle line:84% I was also used as a copy artist for publishing. 00:50:34.900 --> 00:50:37.000 align:middle line:84% I can work in just any style, which 00:50:37.000 --> 00:50:39.910 align:middle line:84% was really valuable in the animation world 00:50:39.910 --> 00:50:43.120 align:middle line:84% because you had to replicate different people's style 00:50:43.120 --> 00:50:45.040 align:middle line:90% and be consistent with it. 00:50:45.040 --> 00:50:46.900 align:middle line:84% And we used to have a running joke. 00:50:46.900 --> 00:50:50.050 align:middle line:84% We'd call each other dialist style. 00:50:50.050 --> 00:50:50.842 align:middle line:90% what's your style? 00:50:50.842 --> 00:50:52.300 align:middle line:84% People are like, what's your style? 00:50:52.300 --> 00:50:54.940 align:middle line:84% And I was like, I don't know, I don't know what my style is. 00:50:54.940 --> 00:50:58.060 align:middle line:90% But I've made peace with that. 00:50:58.060 --> 00:51:01.870 align:middle line:84% So that's-- but that's a persistent question. 00:51:01.870 --> 00:51:04.800 align:middle line:90% Thank you. 00:51:04.800 --> 00:51:07.620 align:middle line:84% Do you think you have a flair because you're 00:51:07.620 --> 00:51:08.985 align:middle line:90% genuinely interested, right? 00:51:08.985 --> 00:51:10.080 align:middle line:90% I think so 00:51:10.080 --> 00:51:11.370 align:middle line:90% You talk about the landscape. 00:51:11.370 --> 00:51:12.420 align:middle line:90% You talk about gardening. 00:51:12.420 --> 00:51:12.960 align:middle line:90% Foraging. 00:51:12.960 --> 00:51:13.860 align:middle line:90% All of that. 00:51:13.860 --> 00:51:14.400 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 00:51:14.400 --> 00:51:18.510 align:middle line:84% I think I was working with-- there was 00:51:18.510 --> 00:51:20.670 align:middle line:90% an Illustrator, Lila Rogers. 00:51:20.670 --> 00:51:22.020 align:middle line:90% I think she's a rep now. 00:51:22.020 --> 00:51:25.950 align:middle line:84% Actually, she's a very successful rep and she has-- 00:51:25.950 --> 00:51:27.390 align:middle line:90% she teaches classes. 00:51:27.390 --> 00:51:30.270 align:middle line:84% A lot of people go into teaching. 00:51:30.270 --> 00:51:32.400 align:middle line:84% How to get illustration work, because there's not 00:51:32.400 --> 00:51:35.070 align:middle line:90% that much illustration work. 00:51:35.070 --> 00:51:37.830 align:middle line:84% But one of the things she says and this is so true. 00:51:37.830 --> 00:51:40.140 align:middle line:90% People buy your joy. 00:51:40.140 --> 00:51:41.310 align:middle line:90% People by your joy. 00:51:41.310 --> 00:51:44.760 align:middle line:84% Like if I sell fine art, it's often 00:51:44.760 --> 00:51:46.800 align:middle line:90% because I had a joyful time. 00:51:46.800 --> 00:51:50.430 align:middle line:84% I just-- the bunny that's on the front of my website 00:51:50.430 --> 00:51:52.590 align:middle line:90% right now, just sold last week. 00:51:52.590 --> 00:51:54.700 align:middle line:90% I loved making it. 00:51:54.700 --> 00:51:58.450 align:middle line:84% And I think there's something strange about that. 00:51:58.450 --> 00:52:01.620 align:middle line:84% But if you really joyfully did something and it's authentic, 00:52:01.620 --> 00:52:04.405 align:middle line:90% people are drawn to that. 00:52:04.405 --> 00:52:05.530 align:middle line:90% So you just said something. 00:52:05.530 --> 00:52:07.740 align:middle line:84% You said there's not much illustration work. 00:52:07.740 --> 00:52:08.740 align:middle line:90% Can you talk about that? 00:52:08.740 --> 00:52:11.860 align:middle line:84% What choices are being made in the commercial space? 00:52:11.860 --> 00:52:17.860 align:middle line:84% Well, what's happened in the last 30 years or so is, 00:52:17.860 --> 00:52:22.690 align:middle line:84% schools were really pumping out a lot of graduates coming out 00:52:22.690 --> 00:52:24.670 align:middle line:90% with illustration portfolios. 00:52:24.670 --> 00:52:27.100 align:middle line:84% And maybe kind of having a formulaic idea 00:52:27.100 --> 00:52:28.750 align:middle line:90% of what they were going to do. 00:52:28.750 --> 00:52:33.910 align:middle line:84% And what I tell people, especially like my own kids 00:52:33.910 --> 00:52:37.180 align:middle line:84% are in their early 20s, and my youngest 00:52:37.180 --> 00:52:42.100 align:middle line:84% is a stand up comedian, and my eldest is a music producer. 00:52:42.100 --> 00:52:43.480 align:middle line:90% So I'm cursed. 00:52:43.480 --> 00:52:45.670 align:middle line:84% So I tell them like, if you're going 00:52:45.670 --> 00:52:48.490 align:middle line:84% to have a creative life, what's the very most 00:52:48.490 --> 00:52:51.670 align:middle line:84% important is, you figure out how to make a living. 00:52:51.670 --> 00:52:52.668 align:middle line:90% One way or another. 00:52:52.668 --> 00:52:53.710 align:middle line:90% I don't care what you do. 00:52:53.710 --> 00:52:55.127 align:middle line:84% You could work in a bakery, or you 00:52:55.127 --> 00:52:57.640 align:middle line:90% could do something tangential. 00:52:57.640 --> 00:53:00.700 align:middle line:84% But something you don't bring home, and make time 00:53:00.700 --> 00:53:01.660 align:middle line:90% for your art. 00:53:01.660 --> 00:53:04.270 align:middle line:84% And make time to develop your art, and then just as 00:53:04.270 --> 00:53:06.740 align:middle line:90% importantly, find your people. 00:53:06.740 --> 00:53:09.310 align:middle line:84% Find the other people that are doing what you're doing. 00:53:09.310 --> 00:53:12.100 align:middle line:84% Find the people that are going to collaborate with you. 00:53:12.100 --> 00:53:15.310 align:middle line:84% And in my opinion, that's success. 00:53:15.310 --> 00:53:19.900 align:middle line:84% And as far as illustration goes, it changes all the time. 00:53:19.900 --> 00:53:22.610 align:middle line:84% Like I've been working now for almost 40 years. 00:53:22.610 --> 00:53:25.360 align:middle line:84% And when I started, everyone wanted 00:53:25.360 --> 00:53:27.100 align:middle line:90% to be a magazine Illustrator. 00:53:27.100 --> 00:53:29.070 align:middle line:84% I want to do editorial illustration. 00:53:29.070 --> 00:53:31.430 align:middle line:84% And I want to get on the cover of Time magazine. 00:53:31.430 --> 00:53:33.790 align:middle line:84% No one even reads magazines anymore. 00:53:33.790 --> 00:53:36.010 align:middle line:84% The internet hadn't even been invented 00:53:36.010 --> 00:53:38.590 align:middle line:90% when I graduated from college. 00:53:38.590 --> 00:53:41.920 align:middle line:84% And everyone I know is still kicking because they 00:53:41.920 --> 00:53:43.220 align:middle line:90% went with the flow. 00:53:43.220 --> 00:53:48.160 align:middle line:84% If you have a creative mind and you can create imagery, 00:53:48.160 --> 00:53:49.420 align:middle line:90% you will have work. 00:53:49.420 --> 00:53:54.340 align:middle line:84% You will have work but you need to find that path. 00:53:54.340 --> 00:53:57.730 align:middle line:90% It's not a formula. 00:53:57.730 --> 00:54:00.460 align:middle line:84% So Melanie had a question about approaching client work, 00:54:00.460 --> 00:54:03.400 align:middle line:84% and I thought it was interesting that you talked about forager. 00:54:03.400 --> 00:54:04.360 align:middle line:90% I think it was forager. 00:54:04.360 --> 00:54:09.790 align:middle line:84% And you hadn't even had a conversation with your contact. 00:54:09.790 --> 00:54:11.920 align:middle line:84% Could you talk about that a little bit? 00:54:11.920 --> 00:54:14.980 align:middle line:84% I got really lucky on both those books with Algonquin, 00:54:14.980 --> 00:54:18.010 align:middle line:84% because of my friend Laura recommended me. 00:54:18.010 --> 00:54:20.110 align:middle line:90% She was really well respected. 00:54:20.110 --> 00:54:27.370 align:middle line:84% And based on the snail book, I've gotten other book work. 00:54:27.370 --> 00:54:30.910 align:middle line:84% Before, when I had to look for work, and really the best way 00:54:30.910 --> 00:54:34.150 align:middle line:84% to look, do not go on LinkedIn and see 00:54:34.150 --> 00:54:36.070 align:middle line:90% what people are looking for. 00:54:36.070 --> 00:54:37.720 align:middle line:90% Don't enter contests. 00:54:37.720 --> 00:54:39.640 align:middle line:90% Don't ever enter contests. 00:54:39.640 --> 00:54:41.170 align:middle line:90% Don't do that. 00:54:41.170 --> 00:54:43.390 align:middle line:84% The money that they're paying in prize money, 00:54:43.390 --> 00:54:44.950 align:middle line:84% some intelligent person should have 00:54:44.950 --> 00:54:49.120 align:middle line:84% been looking for an Illustrator, and pay that Illustrator. 00:54:49.120 --> 00:54:50.290 align:middle line:90% I hate contests. 00:54:50.290 --> 00:54:52.330 align:middle line:90% Can you tell? 00:54:52.330 --> 00:54:55.540 align:middle line:84% But the thing to do is, if you want to-- 00:54:55.540 --> 00:54:59.260 align:middle line:84% still even if you want to illustrate for that [INAUDIBLE] 00:54:59.260 --> 00:55:01.270 align:middle line:84% or the New York Times, or something. 00:55:01.270 --> 00:55:03.340 align:middle line:84% Find out who the art director is. 00:55:03.340 --> 00:55:05.620 align:middle line:90% Find out their email address. 00:55:05.620 --> 00:55:07.660 align:middle line:90% But here's a trick. 00:55:07.660 --> 00:55:09.500 align:middle line:90% This is a small enough room. 00:55:09.500 --> 00:55:11.200 align:middle line:90% I'll let you know this. 00:55:11.200 --> 00:55:15.100 align:middle line:84% People don't expect a phone call. 00:55:15.100 --> 00:55:17.180 align:middle line:90% They don't expect a phone call. 00:55:17.180 --> 00:55:18.220 align:middle line:90% Call them up. 00:55:18.220 --> 00:55:19.810 align:middle line:90% Freak them out. 00:55:19.810 --> 00:55:22.240 align:middle line:90% Say that you're in your 20s. 00:55:22.240 --> 00:55:25.510 align:middle line:84% And you know how to use a phone, and ask them a question. 00:55:25.510 --> 00:55:29.590 align:middle line:84% Ask them how you could get in touch with them. 00:55:29.590 --> 00:55:33.430 align:middle line:84% You are in a magic area if you're in your 20s 00:55:33.430 --> 00:55:35.560 align:middle line:84% that you can call old people like me, 00:55:35.560 --> 00:55:36.940 align:middle line:90% and we love to hear from you. 00:55:36.940 --> 00:55:39.430 align:middle line:90% It makes us still feel alive. 00:55:39.430 --> 00:55:42.400 align:middle line:84% You know, I highly recommend calling people 00:55:42.400 --> 00:55:45.220 align:middle line:84% or sending a postcard if you actually 00:55:45.220 --> 00:55:48.010 align:middle line:90% physically know where they are. 00:55:48.010 --> 00:55:50.710 align:middle line:90% Otherwise, go to events. 00:55:50.710 --> 00:55:54.490 align:middle line:84% Go to-- like the SCBWI conference is 00:55:54.490 --> 00:55:56.110 align:middle line:90% like-- you will get work. 00:55:56.110 --> 00:55:58.520 align:middle line:90% If you bring a portfolio there. 00:55:58.520 --> 00:56:00.220 align:middle line:90% If you start networking. 00:56:00.220 --> 00:56:03.530 align:middle line:84% If you join your local group, you will learn how to do it. 00:56:03.530 --> 00:56:07.540 align:middle line:84% They will walk you through getting a picture book made. 00:56:07.540 --> 00:56:10.270 align:middle line:84% They will walk you through meeting an art director, 00:56:10.270 --> 00:56:12.940 align:middle line:84% meeting a creative director, and showing-- they will tell you 00:56:12.940 --> 00:56:13.898 align:middle line:90% what should be in your. 00:56:13.898 --> 00:56:19.510 align:middle line:90% Portfolio look for other people. 00:56:19.510 --> 00:56:23.810 align:middle line:84% And don't rely on-- yes, have a great Instagram. 00:56:23.810 --> 00:56:25.540 align:middle line:90% Have a consistent Instagram. 00:56:25.540 --> 00:56:26.860 align:middle line:90% Follow people. 00:56:26.860 --> 00:56:29.680 align:middle line:84% But you're not going to get paid for your likes. 00:56:29.680 --> 00:56:32.300 align:middle line:90% That's not how it works. 00:56:32.300 --> 00:56:35.320 align:middle line:84% I have sold things that I've posted on Instagram, 00:56:35.320 --> 00:56:36.940 align:middle line:90% but I could-- 00:56:36.940 --> 00:56:40.030 align:middle line:84% I do know people who do earn a living posting things 00:56:40.030 --> 00:56:40.750 align:middle line:90% on Instagram. 00:56:40.750 --> 00:56:42.680 align:middle line:90% I can tell you not to do that. 00:56:42.680 --> 00:56:45.280 align:middle line:84% But there's other ways of connecting 00:56:45.280 --> 00:56:49.890 align:middle line:84% with people that are going to pay you for your art. 00:56:49.890 --> 00:56:53.340 align:middle line:84% If you really, really like a book cover, 00:56:53.340 --> 00:56:55.170 align:middle line:90% find out who designed it. 00:56:55.170 --> 00:56:56.820 align:middle line:90% They want to see your work. 00:56:56.820 --> 00:56:59.850 align:middle line:84% Get in touch with them and tell them, 00:56:59.850 --> 00:57:04.620 align:middle line:84% I love the cover on this book, and that you did that. 00:57:04.620 --> 00:57:06.840 align:middle line:84% That's great for them to hear that. 00:57:06.840 --> 00:57:09.570 align:middle line:84% If you do contact someone looking for work, 00:57:09.570 --> 00:57:11.760 align:middle line:84% be able to tell them what they did 00:57:11.760 --> 00:57:13.410 align:middle line:90% that you thought was so great. 00:57:13.410 --> 00:57:17.340 align:middle line:84% And so it doesn't look like you're just spamming everybody. 00:57:17.340 --> 00:57:20.850 align:middle line:84% If you want to do a pattern of surface design, 00:57:20.850 --> 00:57:23.070 align:middle line:84% and you're in a store, and you're like, Oh, 00:57:23.070 --> 00:57:27.840 align:middle line:84% that's an amazing greeting card or that's an amazing folder. 00:57:27.840 --> 00:57:29.040 align:middle line:90% Turn it over. 00:57:29.040 --> 00:57:31.830 align:middle line:90% Who made it? 00:57:31.830 --> 00:57:35.340 align:middle line:84% Go on LinkedIn and see who the creative director, or the art 00:57:35.340 --> 00:57:38.640 align:middle line:84% director, or the designer is for that manufacturer, 00:57:38.640 --> 00:57:40.710 align:middle line:84% or for that greeting card company 00:57:40.710 --> 00:57:42.330 align:middle line:90% and contact them directly. 00:57:42.330 --> 00:57:45.570 align:middle line:90% 00:57:45.570 --> 00:57:48.030 align:middle line:90% Be a private eye. 00:57:48.030 --> 00:57:51.010 align:middle line:90% Find those find those people. 00:57:51.010 --> 00:57:53.920 align:middle line:84% Are there any artists or illustrators 00:57:53.920 --> 00:57:54.940 align:middle line:90% who you would recommend? 00:57:54.940 --> 00:57:57.040 align:middle line:84% Who are really exciting right now 00:57:57.040 --> 00:57:59.060 align:middle line:90% that we should be looking at. 00:57:59.060 --> 00:58:01.840 align:middle line:90% I love Raphael Lopez. 00:58:01.840 --> 00:58:04.600 align:middle line:84% He is a children's book Illustrator. 00:58:04.600 --> 00:58:05.960 align:middle line:90% He lives in San Diego. 00:58:05.960 --> 00:58:08.320 align:middle line:84% He's done like big murals there and stuff. 00:58:08.320 --> 00:58:11.470 align:middle line:84% And this past year, he did a set of stamps 00:58:11.470 --> 00:58:15.100 align:middle line:84% for the US Postal Service, Mariachi stamps. 00:58:15.100 --> 00:58:15.710 align:middle line:90% He's amazing. 00:58:15.710 --> 00:58:19.080 align:middle line:90% 00:58:19.080 --> 00:58:21.840 align:middle line:84% That's-- I'm not really like looking at a lot 00:58:21.840 --> 00:58:23.790 align:middle line:90% of illustrators these days. 00:58:23.790 --> 00:58:28.082 align:middle line:90% 00:58:28.082 --> 00:58:31.080 align:middle line:84% I still love like main snaps work. 00:58:31.080 --> 00:58:35.550 align:middle line:84% You know, like the old people like me. 00:58:35.550 --> 00:58:38.350 align:middle line:90% 00:58:38.350 --> 00:58:42.570 align:middle line:84% And what are your favorite digital tools right now? 00:58:42.570 --> 00:58:44.400 align:middle line:90% Oh, boy. 00:58:44.400 --> 00:58:46.590 align:middle line:90% I'm just looking at my desktop. 00:58:46.590 --> 00:58:47.610 align:middle line:90% I've got everything. 00:58:47.610 --> 00:58:51.270 align:middle line:90% I have the entire Adobe suite. 00:58:51.270 --> 00:58:57.330 align:middle line:84% I'm an expert level on all of the Adobe software. 00:58:57.330 --> 00:59:02.340 align:middle line:84% I do like using ProCreate on the iPad. 00:59:02.340 --> 00:59:03.285 align:middle line:90% I like Fresco. 00:59:03.285 --> 00:59:08.130 align:middle line:90% 00:59:08.130 --> 00:59:10.920 align:middle line:84% You mentioned that the illustrations for Forager 00:59:10.920 --> 00:59:14.190 align:middle line:90% were not vetted by a scientist. 00:59:14.190 --> 00:59:16.440 align:middle line:84% Can you talk-- like is that a normal process? 00:59:16.440 --> 00:59:17.680 align:middle line:90% Is that the usual process? 00:59:17.680 --> 00:59:18.810 align:middle line:90% I'm curious about that 00:59:18.810 --> 00:59:20.430 align:middle line:90% Yeah, if this was like-- 00:59:20.430 --> 00:59:25.020 align:middle line:84% if it had been like a field guide 00:59:25.020 --> 00:59:27.000 align:middle line:84% that people would be using, there 00:59:27.000 --> 00:59:32.250 align:middle line:84% would probably be a botanist assigned to the project. 00:59:32.250 --> 00:59:35.040 align:middle line:84% But it was a little off to the side, 00:59:35.040 --> 00:59:36.870 align:middle line:84% and I knew things needed to be accurate. 00:59:36.870 --> 00:59:41.280 align:middle line:84% I double check the Latin names with the creative director. 00:59:41.280 --> 00:59:43.260 align:middle line:84% That was like a lot of the initial discussion. 00:59:43.260 --> 00:59:45.180 align:middle line:84% It was just narrowing down everything 00:59:45.180 --> 00:59:48.870 align:middle line:84% to the actual, exact species because I needed 00:59:48.870 --> 00:59:51.150 align:middle line:90% it to be accurate in that way. 00:59:51.150 --> 00:59:53.850 align:middle line:84% And I actually ended up spending a lot of time 00:59:53.850 --> 00:59:55.950 align:middle line:84% at the Museum of Natural History. 00:59:55.950 --> 00:59:58.890 align:middle line:90% Just running stuff by people. 00:59:58.890 --> 01:00:02.640 align:middle line:84% Like, oh, yeah that looks fine, or like that leaf 01:00:02.640 --> 01:00:05.400 align:middle line:90% show the fur under the leaf. 01:00:05.400 --> 01:00:11.370 align:middle line:84% But also in the descriptions that Michelle had made, 01:00:11.370 --> 01:00:14.760 align:middle line:84% there were specific things that she was using the plants for. 01:00:14.760 --> 01:00:16.900 align:middle line:84% I think she talked about the plants. 01:00:16.900 --> 01:00:20.700 align:middle line:84% And so I tried to illuminate those things so 01:00:20.700 --> 01:00:23.730 align:middle line:90% that it would go with the copy. 01:00:23.730 --> 01:00:27.240 align:middle line:84% Yeah, often if you're given an actual science illustration, 01:00:27.240 --> 01:00:28.890 align:middle line:90% it's attached to-- 01:00:28.890 --> 01:00:32.010 align:middle line:84% it's often commissioned by an organization 01:00:32.010 --> 01:00:36.400 align:middle line:84% and a scientist wants the illustration themselves. 01:00:36.400 --> 01:00:40.260 align:middle line:90% So it's kind of baked in. 01:00:40.260 --> 01:00:42.150 align:middle line:84% A couple of times I've worked on books 01:00:42.150 --> 01:00:46.980 align:middle line:84% where they sent me the Latin name, and a package 01:00:46.980 --> 01:00:48.810 align:middle line:90% of reference material. 01:00:48.810 --> 01:00:52.350 align:middle line:84% And the really great thing about Michelle's book 01:00:52.350 --> 01:00:54.180 align:middle line:84% is when I lived in Pasadena, I used 01:00:54.180 --> 01:00:57.900 align:middle line:84% to go hiking in the Angeles National Forest all the time, 01:00:57.900 --> 01:01:01.560 align:middle line:84% and I had physically interacted with and touched almost 01:01:01.560 --> 01:01:04.440 align:middle line:90% every species that I depicted. 01:01:04.440 --> 01:01:06.870 align:middle line:84% I think the only one I had was the snow 01:01:06.870 --> 01:01:10.827 align:middle line:84% plant, which was the weirdest one and I wish I had seen it. 01:01:10.827 --> 01:01:12.660 align:middle line:84% So you're working with the publishing house. 01:01:12.660 --> 01:01:15.540 align:middle line:84% You're not working with Michelle, necessarily, 01:01:15.540 --> 01:01:16.230 align:middle line:90% are there-- 01:01:16.230 --> 01:01:17.350 align:middle line:90% or are you? 01:01:17.350 --> 01:01:17.850 align:middle line:90% No. 01:01:17.850 --> 01:01:20.790 align:middle line:84% This is the interesting thing about publishing. 01:01:20.790 --> 01:01:23.850 align:middle line:84% And it didn't make sense at first. 01:01:23.850 --> 01:01:27.610 align:middle line:84% The first time I did anything with a publisher, 01:01:27.610 --> 01:01:30.930 align:middle line:84% they wouldn't even tell me who the author was. 01:01:30.930 --> 01:01:32.530 align:middle line:84% They're like, we want you to do this, 01:01:32.530 --> 01:01:36.390 align:middle line:84% and it really had to do with that the editor, the marketing 01:01:36.390 --> 01:01:39.750 align:middle line:84% department, they could they're picturing a product 01:01:39.750 --> 01:01:43.440 align:middle line:84% that they're going to sell and they like things 01:01:43.440 --> 01:01:48.540 align:middle line:84% to go smoothly, and what if we didn't get along, 01:01:48.540 --> 01:01:52.630 align:middle line:84% or what if things could go off the rails. 01:01:52.630 --> 01:01:55.110 align:middle line:84% And I thought that was really, after working in animation 01:01:55.110 --> 01:01:57.030 align:middle line:84% where everyone wanted to meet each other 01:01:57.030 --> 01:01:58.650 align:middle line:84% and make things together, I thought 01:01:58.650 --> 01:02:00.690 align:middle line:90% it was the craziest thing. 01:02:00.690 --> 01:02:03.240 align:middle line:90% And almost everyone, like-- 01:02:03.240 --> 01:02:06.390 align:middle line:90% the author for the snail book. 01:02:06.390 --> 01:02:07.590 align:middle line:90% Now we know each other. 01:02:07.590 --> 01:02:10.560 align:middle line:84% We're really-- we actually Zoomed all throughout COVID. 01:02:10.560 --> 01:02:13.830 align:middle line:90% It was a Godsend. 01:02:13.830 --> 01:02:15.610 align:middle line:90% I tend to get along with people. 01:02:15.610 --> 01:02:17.310 align:middle line:90% But I was like, OK. 01:02:17.310 --> 01:02:18.480 align:middle line:90% I do respect that. 01:02:18.480 --> 01:02:20.540 align:middle line:84% And especially children's books, I 01:02:20.540 --> 01:02:23.310 align:middle line:84% think it's really important to know as it illustrated, 01:02:23.310 --> 01:02:24.960 align:middle line:84% if you want to do children's books, 01:02:24.960 --> 01:02:28.800 align:middle line:84% do not find a writer whose book you're going to illustrate. 01:02:28.800 --> 01:02:30.270 align:middle line:90% Don't do that. 01:02:30.270 --> 01:02:34.380 align:middle line:84% If you want to have a big book that's in every store. 01:02:34.380 --> 01:02:36.248 align:middle line:84% That everyone's going to read their kids, 01:02:36.248 --> 01:02:37.290 align:middle line:90% and get in every library. 01:02:37.290 --> 01:02:39.780 align:middle line:84% It's going to come through a major publisher 01:02:39.780 --> 01:02:44.460 align:middle line:84% and the publisher looks at the manuscript 01:02:44.460 --> 01:02:47.520 align:middle line:84% and hires the Illustrator that matches that manuscript, 01:02:47.520 --> 01:02:48.722 align:middle line:90% in their opinion. 01:02:48.722 --> 01:02:50.430 align:middle line:84% And there's been several children's books 01:02:50.430 --> 01:02:53.340 align:middle line:84% that are re-illustrated with different illustrators 01:02:53.340 --> 01:02:57.000 align:middle line:84% at different times, but it's not connected. 01:02:57.000 --> 01:02:59.730 align:middle line:84% Some people do go hand in hand, and they 01:02:59.730 --> 01:03:01.740 align:middle line:84% do-- you could patch a project together, 01:03:01.740 --> 01:03:03.570 align:middle line:84% but you're cutting your chances in half 01:03:03.570 --> 01:03:05.670 align:middle line:90% of getting it published. 01:03:05.670 --> 01:03:10.320 align:middle line:84% It's an interesting phenomenon but it makes sense. 01:03:10.320 --> 01:03:15.190 align:middle line:84% And that, again, at SCBWI they would walk you through that 01:03:15.190 --> 01:03:15.780 align:middle line:90% "Why?' 01:03:15.780 --> 01:03:17.520 align:middle line:84% That's the case and that you need 01:03:17.520 --> 01:03:22.050 align:middle line:84% to just build a good general purpose portfolio 01:03:22.050 --> 01:03:23.880 align:middle line:90% and make yourself available. 01:03:23.880 --> 01:03:26.190 align:middle line:90% And SCBWI again? 01:03:26.190 --> 01:03:29.020 align:middle line:84% The Society of Children's Books Writers and Illustrators. 01:03:29.020 --> 01:03:30.547 align:middle line:90% OK, got it. 01:03:30.547 --> 01:03:31.380 align:middle line:90% So it's interesting. 01:03:31.380 --> 01:03:33.030 align:middle line:90% Michelle, I don't know if you-- 01:03:33.030 --> 01:03:36.390 align:middle line:84% sorry not to call you out, but last week, Michelle 01:03:36.390 --> 01:03:38.500 align:middle line:84% talked a little bit about her process. 01:03:38.500 --> 01:03:41.940 align:middle line:84% And similarly, she talked about having to let go there. 01:03:41.940 --> 01:03:44.440 align:middle line:84% Were certain things that she couldn't make a decision about. 01:03:44.440 --> 01:03:46.535 align:middle line:84% And the cover was certainly one of them. 01:03:46.535 --> 01:03:47.910 align:middle line:84% I don't know if you have anything 01:03:47.910 --> 01:03:49.080 align:middle line:90% to add about that, Michelle. 01:03:49.080 --> 01:03:52.760 align:middle line:84% I thought that was really interesting. 01:03:52.760 --> 01:03:57.290 align:middle line:84% Yeah, I didn't meet Susan until I am after. 01:03:57.290 --> 01:03:59.618 align:middle line:90% I added her Facebook. 01:03:59.618 --> 01:04:00.410 align:middle line:90% Well, not Facebook. 01:04:00.410 --> 01:04:01.190 align:middle line:90% Probably on Insta. 01:04:01.190 --> 01:04:02.270 align:middle line:90% Instagram, yeah. 01:04:02.270 --> 01:04:04.040 align:middle line:90% Instagram. 01:04:04.040 --> 01:04:07.580 align:middle line:90% After, I saw the gallery. 01:04:07.580 --> 01:04:09.200 align:middle line:90% I mean, they didn't even-- 01:04:09.200 --> 01:04:12.440 align:middle line:84% they wouldn't even let me see it until it had already been 01:04:12.440 --> 01:04:13.700 align:middle line:90% approved, and it was too late. 01:04:13.700 --> 01:04:15.587 align:middle line:84% So if I had not liked two illustrations, 01:04:15.587 --> 01:04:17.420 align:middle line:84% it would have made no difference whatsoever. 01:04:17.420 --> 01:04:18.500 align:middle line:90% Exactly. 01:04:18.500 --> 01:04:19.460 align:middle line:90% Exactly 01:04:19.460 --> 01:04:21.270 align:middle line:84% Although, I did like them very much. 01:04:21.270 --> 01:04:24.140 align:middle line:84% And then I reached out to you, but Yeah. 01:04:24.140 --> 01:04:27.170 align:middle line:84% It's fascinating the way you explained it from your side, 01:04:27.170 --> 01:04:28.760 align:middle line:90% because they did not-- 01:04:28.760 --> 01:04:31.640 align:middle line:84% I did have someone that I knew and they-- 01:04:31.640 --> 01:04:35.840 align:middle line:84% Algonquin went just-- was like, no, this isn't your call. 01:04:35.840 --> 01:04:37.880 align:middle line:90% Exactly 01:04:37.880 --> 01:04:39.920 align:middle line:84% So anyway, but you did such a lovely job, Susan. 01:04:39.920 --> 01:04:40.870 align:middle line:90% So I'm so grateful. 01:04:40.870 --> 01:04:41.370 align:middle line:90% Thank you. 01:04:41.370 --> 01:04:44.420 align:middle line:90% It was a privilege. 01:04:44.420 --> 01:04:44.920 align:middle line:90% Excellent. 01:04:44.920 --> 01:04:45.750 align:middle line:90% Thank you both. 01:04:45.750 --> 01:04:46.312 align:middle line:90% Stephanie. 01:04:46.312 --> 01:04:47.145 align:middle line:90% You have a question? 01:04:47.145 --> 01:04:50.510 align:middle line:90% 01:04:50.510 --> 01:04:51.010 align:middle line:90% Yeah. 01:04:51.010 --> 01:04:53.930 align:middle line:84% I actually had a couple of questions. 01:04:53.930 --> 01:04:56.110 align:middle line:84% I was wondering, how did it feel to work 01:04:56.110 --> 01:04:58.360 align:middle line:84% in so many different kinds of media 01:04:58.360 --> 01:05:00.850 align:middle line:84% with like advertisement, and like the movies, 01:05:00.850 --> 01:05:03.010 align:middle line:84% and the computer games, and like did you 01:05:03.010 --> 01:05:04.480 align:middle line:90% have a favorite amongst those? 01:05:04.480 --> 01:05:08.230 align:middle line:84% Or is painting just your real favorite 01:05:08.230 --> 01:05:09.890 align:middle line:90% when you moved on from those? 01:05:09.890 --> 01:05:14.250 align:middle line:84% I think I just like making imagery, and it-- 01:05:14.250 --> 01:05:16.960 align:middle line:84% it changes all the time what I want to do. 01:05:16.960 --> 01:05:19.630 align:middle line:84% And I used to think that was really problematic, 01:05:19.630 --> 01:05:26.480 align:middle line:84% but enough times gone by that, I'm a jack of all trades. 01:05:26.480 --> 01:05:29.650 align:middle line:84% I'm really, really enjoying life drawing 01:05:29.650 --> 01:05:36.130 align:middle line:84% and sketching animals and plants now. 01:05:36.130 --> 01:05:38.210 align:middle line:84% Like I said, I'm starting to paint more. 01:05:38.210 --> 01:05:40.030 align:middle line:90% I don't think I have a favorite. 01:05:40.030 --> 01:05:44.050 align:middle line:84% And I feel really fortunate that I was given so much opportunity 01:05:44.050 --> 01:05:47.090 align:middle line:90% to try so many things out. 01:05:47.090 --> 01:05:49.700 align:middle line:84% Well, and then my other question was, 01:05:49.700 --> 01:05:51.650 align:middle line:84% what was it like working on the--, 01:05:51.650 --> 01:05:54.710 align:middle line:84% I think it was with the computer games, how it was classified 01:05:54.710 --> 01:05:56.510 align:middle line:84% and you couldn't share it with anyone, 01:05:56.510 --> 01:05:58.670 align:middle line:84% and you can even have your significant other go 01:05:58.670 --> 01:05:59.280 align:middle line:90% to the party. 01:05:59.280 --> 01:06:01.100 align:middle line:90% I thought that was those, Wow. 01:06:01.100 --> 01:06:02.370 align:middle line:90% It was like the worst. 01:06:02.370 --> 01:06:05.400 align:middle line:84% Like, the best thing was like there was enough other people 01:06:05.400 --> 01:06:05.900 align:middle line:90% there. 01:06:05.900 --> 01:06:08.600 align:middle line:84% Like I said, there was 25 people in the art department. 01:06:08.600 --> 01:06:11.220 align:middle line:90% So we knew what was up. 01:06:11.220 --> 01:06:15.620 align:middle line:84% And you know, like people had asked when we were-- 01:06:15.620 --> 01:06:17.990 align:middle line:84% I think some people came up with cover stories. 01:06:17.990 --> 01:06:21.330 align:middle line:84% I would just say, like, we had to sign a piece of paper. 01:06:21.330 --> 01:06:25.970 align:middle line:84% It was so laughable at the end that the technology didn't even 01:06:25.970 --> 01:06:27.426 align:middle line:90% happen. 01:06:27.426 --> 01:06:30.800 align:middle line:84% It was just ludicrous but while I was working there, 01:06:30.800 --> 01:06:33.200 align:middle line:84% there was so many of us, and we needed 01:06:33.200 --> 01:06:37.220 align:middle line:84% to be using the fastest, most efficient equipment. 01:06:37.220 --> 01:06:40.400 align:middle line:90% Like we were using like top of-- 01:06:40.400 --> 01:06:42.890 align:middle line:84% cutting, bleeding edge technology. 01:06:42.890 --> 01:06:45.950 align:middle line:84% And there were so many of us in the art department 01:06:45.950 --> 01:06:50.990 align:middle line:84% that we were a beta testing pod for Photoshop. 01:06:50.990 --> 01:06:53.120 align:middle line:84% And when we started that project, 01:06:53.120 --> 01:06:56.190 align:middle line:90% Photoshop did not have layers. 01:06:56.190 --> 01:06:59.580 align:middle line:90% Photoshop did not have layers. 01:06:59.580 --> 01:07:02.340 align:middle line:84% You had to make all these different pictures. 01:07:02.340 --> 01:07:04.020 align:middle line:84% If you were going to present a client, 01:07:04.020 --> 01:07:09.060 align:middle line:84% you had to do picture A, picture B. You were using so much space 01:07:09.060 --> 01:07:11.580 align:middle line:84% up on your drive just having all these different files, 01:07:11.580 --> 01:07:13.140 align:middle line:90% and keeping them organized. 01:07:13.140 --> 01:07:15.810 align:middle line:84% We begged Adobe, like please, if there's 01:07:15.810 --> 01:07:18.300 align:middle line:84% anything you're going to do because we 01:07:18.300 --> 01:07:19.590 align:middle line:90% were using After Effects. 01:07:19.590 --> 01:07:22.020 align:middle line:90% Adobe didn't own After Effects. 01:07:22.020 --> 01:07:25.530 align:middle line:84% It was owned by a small company in Rhode Island. 01:07:25.530 --> 01:07:27.300 align:middle line:90% And After Effects had layers. 01:07:27.300 --> 01:07:28.800 align:middle line:84% And we were like, look at this, look 01:07:28.800 --> 01:07:30.580 align:middle line:90% at this, what you could do? 01:07:30.580 --> 01:07:32.640 align:middle line:84% And so not only did they add layers, 01:07:32.640 --> 01:07:38.880 align:middle line:84% that was version 2 of Photoshop, they bought After Effects. 01:07:38.880 --> 01:07:42.240 align:middle line:84% And it was partly because we were doing that. 01:07:42.240 --> 01:07:45.240 align:middle line:84% So there was the pros to that, and working 01:07:45.240 --> 01:07:46.480 align:middle line:90% with these amazing-- 01:07:46.480 --> 01:07:51.120 align:middle line:84% I don't know how, but they found a ton of programmers 01:07:51.120 --> 01:07:54.310 align:middle line:84% to work on this, and they pay-- they were paying handsomely, 01:07:54.310 --> 01:07:57.090 align:middle line:84% like I got my day rate for three years. 01:07:57.090 --> 01:07:59.920 align:middle line:90% That was a lot of money. 01:07:59.920 --> 01:08:01.860 align:middle line:84% And these programmers were paid really well. 01:08:01.860 --> 01:08:03.210 align:middle line:90% They were vetted really well. 01:08:03.210 --> 01:08:05.040 align:middle line:84% The programmers in charge were vetting 01:08:05.040 --> 01:08:08.220 align:middle line:84% and again this is before the internet was huge. 01:08:08.220 --> 01:08:09.990 align:middle line:84% This was before there was Google. 01:08:09.990 --> 01:08:11.670 align:middle line:84% If you were a programmer, you were 01:08:11.670 --> 01:08:14.220 align:middle line:84% a nerd that probably couldn't talk to people. 01:08:14.220 --> 01:08:16.439 align:middle line:84% And I had worked in effects houses. 01:08:16.439 --> 01:08:21.310 align:middle line:84% They were doing 3D animations CGI. 01:08:21.310 --> 01:08:22.720 align:middle line:90% Writing the code. 01:08:22.720 --> 01:08:24.617 align:middle line:84% Like I worked on a Barbie commercial 01:08:24.617 --> 01:08:26.200 align:middle line:84% and there was programmers in the back. 01:08:26.200 --> 01:08:30.040 align:middle line:84% Five programmers writing code for Barbie's hair. 01:08:30.040 --> 01:08:33.170 align:middle line:84% It wasn't-- you couldn't buy it out of the box. 01:08:33.170 --> 01:08:35.060 align:middle line:90% That's what people were doing. 01:08:35.060 --> 01:08:36.880 align:middle line:90% And so these programmers-- 01:08:36.880 --> 01:08:41.590 align:middle line:84% they somehow found programmers at AT&T that had social skills. 01:08:41.590 --> 01:08:44.439 align:middle line:84% That could communicate, and collaborate with you. 01:08:44.439 --> 01:08:46.660 align:middle line:84% I'm still friends with all these programmers. 01:08:46.660 --> 01:08:49.029 align:middle line:84% They went on to have leadership positions 01:08:49.029 --> 01:08:54.080 align:middle line:84% because they could run meetings and follow up on communication. 01:08:54.080 --> 01:08:56.620 align:middle line:84% And I still know a lot of programmers 01:08:56.620 --> 01:08:58.540 align:middle line:90% that just don't do that. 01:08:58.540 --> 01:09:03.410 align:middle line:84% They do brilliant code and they need a different situation. 01:09:03.410 --> 01:09:05.500 align:middle line:84% But yeah, that was the upside of it. 01:09:05.500 --> 01:09:09.460 align:middle line:84% Being top secret, that's what made it worth 01:09:09.460 --> 01:09:11.529 align:middle line:90% doing that project. 01:09:11.529 --> 01:09:14.069 align:middle line:84% That's amazing, and thank you for sharing that with us. 01:09:14.069 --> 01:09:14.890 align:middle line:90% That's awesome. 01:09:14.890 --> 01:09:17.718 align:middle line:90% 01:09:17.718 --> 01:09:20.260 align:middle line:84% Well, Thank you all for being here, and a huge thanks to you, 01:09:20.260 --> 01:09:22.960 align:middle line:84% Susan for sharing about your history, 01:09:22.960 --> 01:09:26.140 align:middle line:84% and your educational journey, and your process. 01:09:26.140 --> 01:09:27.470 align:middle line:90% It's really incredible. 01:09:27.470 --> 01:09:29.870 align:middle line:84% We appreciate you all for spending time with us today. 01:09:29.870 --> 01:09:32.080 align:middle line:84% And again, huge thanks to you Susan. 01:09:32.080 --> 01:09:34.102 align:middle line:90% Thank you. 01:09:34.102 --> 01:09:38.629 align:middle line:90% [AUDIO LOGO] 01:09:38.629 --> 01:09:58.000 align:middle line:90%